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#114637 - 05/23/03 03:42 PM Pipe running thru J Box  
Admin  Offline

Administrator
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,434
NY, USA
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]
Quote
Found this one yesterday at a school. What you're looking at is a junction box in a ceiling. Notice the pipe running all the way through.

George Corron


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#114638 - 05/23/03 04:13 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
Joe Tedesco  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
George:

What's in the raceway?

At one time about 20 years ago, I too discussed this with the Former Chairman of the NEC Committee Richard Lloyd, and he said that this was acceptable if the installer wanted to accomplish the separation between certain types of conductors.

It does look funny, but what are the hazards and is it on a government site where electrical inspections may not be considered?

Joe


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

#114639 - 05/23/03 06:05 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
txsparky  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
Magnolia,.Texas U.S.A.
I would be more concerned with the acessibility of the j-box with all of the other pipes and cables in front of it


Donnie

#114640 - 05/23/03 07:01 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
Right or wrong I've done that several times when upon doing service to a piece of Tank Monitering equipment I've found allegedly intrinsically safe wiring mixed in with 120 and 240 volt controls. Its been done outside in a trough that been installed to accept many 3/4 pipes from a gasoline install. I generally shake my head in disbelief that anyone would mix the wires in with controls but.....


#114641 - 05/23/03 09:07 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
George Corron  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 717
Lorton, Va USA
Joe,
I consider it a violation of several articles, not the least of which is 110-3 which is how materials are to be utlilized.
The conductors are fire alarm conductors, and fire and security conductors are included in the box.

The disparate bonds are what concerns me the most. Should a fault occur on either the pipe, or the box, there would quite likely be a sizable arc to the item not securely fastened.

Walrus, did you forget to bring your bender with you to go around the box instead of through it? I don't understand. I have also shielded intrinsically safe conductors, but also managed to use connectors for a solid grounding connection or went around the offending item in the way.

Accessibility is one of the issues brought to the contractors attention.


#114642 - 05/24/03 06:55 AM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
Didn't forget anything but when its installed wrong and I'm sent in to repair another problem I try to fix it the best I can. The conduit in question mught be in the middle of 15 or 20 parellel pipes with only 2 feet exposed above ground with a vertical seal off. I realize some customer might pay to fix it right but in Maine where money is tight that isn't common. I see no problem putting a 4.5" nipple straight up thru a 4" raintight trough, putting a 3/4 myers hub on top and then continuing into the building. It may violate a code but its certainly better than having conductors that are supposed to be safe mixed in with AC controls. The conduit going thru is bonded by lock nuts just like the rest of the pipes.

[This message has been edited by walrus (edited 05-24-2003).]


#114643 - 05/24/03 07:25 AM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
Joe Tedesco  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,749
Boston, Massachusetts USA
George, How in the heck are you doing!

No doubt you are absolutely correct!

Please post the images after you have had the correction fixed.

Is that possible up there on the hill, or will the Senator give the job his blessings?

Washington, DC is a great place for "My Types of Photo Shoots"

I will take some there soon in June!


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

#114644 - 05/24/03 11:23 AM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
golf junkie  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 507
York, NE
I support Walrus on this one.

Although I've never done this I often face situations where you have to make judgement calls about "making the best of a bad situation".....it's just part of the job.

GJ


#114645 - 05/24/03 09:17 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
Redsy  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,056
Bucks County PA
I wouldn't do it.
There is another photo somewhere her of an installation of several larger pipes running through a trough into a panel.


#114646 - 05/24/03 10:00 PM Re: Pipe running thru J Box  
txsparky  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
Magnolia,.Texas U.S.A.
Here it is Redsy....

[Linked Image]


Donnie


Donnie

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