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#114147 - 01/13/03 04:38 PM Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
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Posts: 3142
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#1: I believe most of this is 14AWG. There might be some 12AWG, bottom left.



#2: Is it permissible to loop conductors around the screws as is shown here? The top has third conductor, barely under the screw.



#3: A little movement and the conductor came loose.

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ThinkGood

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#114148 - 01/13/03 05:45 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
lighthouse Offline
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Registered: 01/02/03
Posts: 141
Loc: philadelphia pa 19125
3 wires under one terminal..that's a no no.

i have seen this practice many times were a single conductor is wrap around 1 terminal

the white wires on the switch is not marked with black tape. this is a hot conductor.

i hope this box had an exstention ring.that adds to the total cubic inch of the box

and where are the grounds from the 2 romex cable.

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#114149 - 01/13/03 06:20 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
SvenNYC Offline
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Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 1685
Loc: New York City
I don't see an extender ring....

Was this four (two duplex) switches in one 4 x 4?

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#114150 - 01/13/03 06:33 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
HotLine1 Offline

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Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6804
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Now think about this; how else could you make up that box, if the boss only gave you ONE WIRENUT??

That's all I see.
BTW; it looks like the ground conductors from the NMC are "there", but there is no ground screw/clip visable.

A lot of effort went into putting that mess together.
John
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#114151 - 01/13/03 06:44 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
ga.sparky56 Offline
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Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 582
Loc: young harris georgia usa
That looks like its been there awhile. If I did that there would be a fire in about 2 days! Or less.

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#114152 - 01/14/03 08:19 AM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
ThinkGood Offline
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Registered: 08/07/02
Posts: 1084
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
OK, OK, here's the story.

THIS WAS IN THE DETATCHED GARAGE AT MY HOUSE WHEN I MOVED IN!

(Sorry for shouting.)

Can you believe it? No, there was not an extender on the box. There was a duplex switch (am I using the correct term) on the right--a switch over a switch. To the left was a 3-way. This whole mess follows underground back to the house where the second 3-way switch is located.

There also had been a duplex receptacle further down the line, which had a strange characteristic: Plugging in a device in the top receptacle disabled the bottom one.

When I opened up the device, I found some spider eggs in there. I wonder if that had something to do with it.

Yes, it does appear that somebody spent quite some time putting it all together.

Here's how it was grounded:



It appears to me that the bare wire is of a smaller gauge than the others.

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#114153 - 01/14/03 09:26 AM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
ThinkGood Offline
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Registered: 08/07/02
Posts: 1084
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
lighthouse: As to the practice of looping the conductor around (that is, removing some insulation without cutting the conductor) -- was that ever OK as per the NEC?

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#114154 - 01/14/03 10:09 AM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
resqcapt19 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2209
Loc: IL
I don't know of any code rule that says you can't loop a wire around the screw terminal of a device and continue to another device. This practice was, at one time, required by the specs for a major fast food chain for the outlets that served the cash registers.
Don
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#114155 - 01/14/03 12:15 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
lighthouse Offline
Member

Registered: 01/02/03
Posts: 141
Loc: philadelphia pa 19125
ThinkGood...i did not find anything in the code book saying you can or can not do this.the only thing i found on this is article 110-14-a ...i do see this done all the time in old res wiring(knob and tube)the wire comes into the box around the screw and off to the next sw/rec with about 2/3 inches of wire in the box.it's allway fun trying to change the sw or rec.

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#114156 - 01/14/03 08:42 PM Re: Box Fill? ... This Box is Full!
ElectricAL Offline
Member

Registered: 10/10/01
Posts: 615
Loc: Minneapolis, MN USA
ThinkGood,

The reduced ground wire dates that piece of romex (is it UF?) to the mid '60s.

Al
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Al Hildenbrand

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