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#110654 - 05/31/06 04:52 PM Pool Violation
Trumpy Offline

Member

Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8540
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Thanks to Harold Endean for these pics and info:
Quote:
Here are some more violations. Pool service: I went out on an old clean up inspection. This pool wasn't finaled out( for what ever reason) anyway, I go out for a final inspection. You will see where the service panel is on the side of the hill.

Pictures 1 & 2 show the panel mounted near the pool equipment but only 24" away from the side of the cliff.







This picture shows how the hill slopes down away from the pool area.



This picture shows that there is only about 24 inches between the panel and the edge of the wall. Which is over-grown with vegetation making it slippery when wet. Also the cover opens up toward the hillside which gives you even less than 24".



This picture shows that if you do slip, the good news is that fence will catch you, however that fence is about 15-5 feet away from you straight down over rock and scrub brush.



Needless to say, this pool failed final inspection.
Harold

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 05-31-2006).]

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#110655 - 05/31/06 05:17 PM Re: Pool Violation
BigJohn Offline
Member

Registered: 03/06/04
Posts: 352
Loc: Boston, MA
I definitely think this is a low-ball installation, but I can also see someone fighting that red tag:

Maybe it's the photos, but the hill in front of the panel doesn't look too steep to stand on, and nothing in 110.26 says it has to be perfectly flat. Unless this was building codes?

Just playing devils advocate.

-John

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#110656 - 05/31/06 11:50 PM Re: Pool Violation
Trumpy Offline

Member

Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8540
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Harold,
I'm no Civil or Structural Engineer, but how far is the pool from it's equipment and how large is it?.
What I'm more or less thinking is, is there a sufficient retaining wall at the bottom there?.
Can anyone say L-A-N-D-S-L-I-D-E??.
Pools full of water carry a HUGE mass and if the earth underneath it cannot withstand that, it will simply just end up below the fence.
A cubic metre of water weighs 1 Tonne

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 06-01-2006).]
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#110657 - 06/02/06 07:42 AM Re: Pool Violation
RSmike Offline
Member

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 130
Loc: Holland, MI USA
I agree with BigJohn. There's nothing in 110.26 that would make this wrong. Perhaps a grade requirement is necessary to prevent this sort of installation.

The red tag would be the opinion of the AHJ and not an article within the code.

RSlater,
RSmike

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#110658 - 06/04/06 09:03 AM Re: Pool Violation
harold endean Offline
Member

Registered: 02/16/02
Posts: 2248
Loc: Boonton, NJ
I can see how the pictures don't really show the danger on this site. However I will try to explain. When the panel cover is closed, you have just under 24" before you step off of this small rock wall. The rock wall is overgrown right now and it is hard to see it. In picture 4 you see a small area of brown right in front of that panel. If you took just 1 step back the drop right there is about 3 feet deep. Then the hill just drops off rapidly from there. If the panel door is open you can't walk around it to go past the pool panel. There isn't enough room, the space between the open door and edge of walkway is less than 12". So if you were standing/or most likely kneeling in front of this panel and if sparked you would fall backward, drop 3 foot down, then roll down that hill about 25-35' more till that fence caught you. You don't even want to know what is on the other side of the fence. It keeps dropping off.
This pool panel/equipment is located about 25-30 feet away from the pool on the downward side of this hill from the pool. I know that a red tag here might be questionable, but I will wait to see what the homeowner has to say. I would just like to see if safe for anyone who has to work on it. As for now I will apply 110.26 (1) for the step back distance to the equipment. I will let you know what happens.

P.S. There was plenty of space to locate this panel in other areas. I Think they wanted down here below the wall so they wouldn't have to see it. If they located up higher near the pool, they wouldn't have had any trouble.

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#110659 - 07/16/06 09:41 PM Re: Pool Violation
tdhorne Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/01
Posts: 344
Loc: Maryland, USA
I'm with Harold on this one gals and guys. If you have less than the clearance in 110.26 (1) before a steep drop that panel should fail. Would any of you want to test it while kneeling beneath it's cover on one foot of wall?
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous for general use." Thomas Alva Edison
_________________________
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous for general use" Thomas Alva Edison

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#110660 - 07/17/06 02:06 AM Re: Pool Violation
Trumpy Offline

Member

Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8540
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Good call Tom,
I can't imagine sailing down an incline and then falling to my ultimate peril because of an electrical job.
Harold gets a big plus from me, for failing this one.
_________________________
Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin

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#110661 - 07/17/06 05:02 PM Re: Pool Violation
Theelectrikid Offline
Member

Registered: 04/30/04
Posts: 854
Loc: Levittown, PA
Mmmm, poison sumac, my favorite. Harold, I can't appreciate you enough for failing that. Land/waterslide anyone?

Ian A.
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#110662 - 07/18/06 07:52 PM Re: Pool Violation
allen476 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/21/06
Posts: 7
Loc: Elmira,NY
I have to agree with the AHJ as well. However the last I knew the right angle supporting those panels is not direct burial rated. Also I don't see any strut straps (or any straps) on the pipes as well. Maybe just me...Allen

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#110663 - 08/04/06 03:53 AM Re: Pool Violation
kiwi Offline
Member

Registered: 12/04/04
Posts: 347
Loc: christchurch new zealand
Thats a steep drop ! You'd break your neck if you fell off. Bad panel position ?

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