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#109706 - 11/24/05 05:26 AM Blank as Panel Part
electure Offline

Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4229
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
Forwarded by Joe Tedesco:

Joe, my apprentice in my second year class came across this situation where a 4 square blank cover was used in a piece of
switchgear to support a 480 volt breaker to the bus.

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#109707 - 11/24/05 06:06 AM Re: Blank as Panel Part
iwire Offline
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4343
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
It looks fine to me.

It is simply a bracket to hold the tail end of a breaker, it does not carry current or provide a fault path it is most likely stronger than the factory part.

I would have ordered the correct part but if I was in a panel and saw this I would not worry about it or recommend it be replaced.

Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
#109708 - 11/24/05 05:14 PM Re: Blank as Panel Part
electricman2 Offline
Registered: 11/09/03
Posts: 234
Loc: Thomasville, NC USA
Blank covers are pretty thick metal. I wonder how he made that offset bend?
#109709 - 11/24/05 08:18 PM Re: Blank as Panel Part
NORCAL Offline
Registered: 09/25/02
Posts: 807
If they had a brake around, no problem to bend cover.
#109710 - 11/25/05 12:48 AM Re: Blank as Panel Part
e57 Offline
Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
"support a 480 volt breaker to the bus"?

Was this an actuall electrical connection? If so, no way!

Non current carrying support, hmmm OK....
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
#109711 - 11/25/05 11:58 AM Re: Blank as Panel Part
PCBelarge Offline
Registered: 06/08/03
Posts: 657
Loc: Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
I do not see how this is okay at all???????

Professionals find a way to make it work, but not this way. Isn't that why we are professionals? It physically works, but this is not right. Supply houses and manufacturers are in business to supply this type of material, so we can get it done............OH WAIT.... we don't have the time to do it with the proper material, lets see, HMMMMMM,lets see what we can do to make it work.

This is a problem with the "culture" of our industry. It works, so it is okay... and we wonder why it is so hard to try and raise our industry back up to where it should be.

And the guy who does want to do it properly will have a hard time convincing the customer that it has to be done properly, as the next guy is ready to do it CHEAP & QUICK.

I can see how this culture change is going to be an uphill battle for quite some time to be.
Pierre Belarge
#109712 - 11/25/05 12:12 PM Re: Blank as Panel Part
Lostazhell Offline
Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1248
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Under a bolted fault condition would those 2 button head screws be enough to hold that breaker tight if things started "jumping around"? I could see this for a temp fix maybe, but I'd certainly seek out the proper mounting hardware to keep things within UL specs...

Was the breaker even designed for the gear it was installed with?

#109713 - 11/25/05 12:20 PM Re: Blank as Panel Part
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
Funny...I was just working on some gear that looked like that.

In my task, I was hindered by the little detail that the maker had stopped making his Fine Pieces of Engineering. While I was able to locate the breakers I needed, I was not able to obtain the necessary hardware.
So, in my case, I spent a pile of money having a machine shop duplicate existing hardware. Not only did I need plates like the one fabricated here, I needed aluminum standards for connecting the breaker to the busses.

This gear, btw, had 1/4-20 bolts as the typical connectors.

[This message has been edited by renosteinke (edited 11-25-2005).]

[This message has been edited by renosteinke (edited 11-25-2005).]
#109714 - 11/27/05 09:58 AM Re: Blank as Panel Part
e57 Offline
Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
"Non current carrying support, [begrudging]hmmm OK...."

Personally, I would have a part remanufactured if no longer made by the original manufacturer. There are places I could attempt to locate original parts as well. And a shop I can get anything I want made, and they often have factory drawings for the equipment parts.

If it were a current carrying part... This would not be acceptable! Non-current carrying, I wouldn't do it, but don't see this a danger.
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
#109715 - 11/27/05 12:23 PM Re: Blank as Panel Part
mxslick Offline
Registered: 10/24/04
Posts: 785
Loc: Atomic City, ID USA
Don't like this at all. Too sloppy and despite the thickness of the blank, inadequate mounting by those tiny screws.

In reality I would be far more concerned by all the metal shavings on that bottom rail!
Stupid should be painful.


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