The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#108463 - 04/13/04 05:15 AM 10 meters
electure Offline


Member
Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4229
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
Quote:
What's wrong with this picture? All safety switches are being used as
Service Disconnects on a multi occupancy building. Is this dangerous or
is it practical?


George Little


Top
2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
#108464 - 04/13/04 08:20 PM Re: 10 meters
Lostazhell Offline
Member
Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1248
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Are they sandwiched together to the point that the disconnect handles can't move???

-Randy
Top
#108465 - 04/13/04 08:29 PM Re: 10 meters
DougW Offline
Member
Registered: 06/08/03
Posts: 1083
Loc: North Chicago, IL
From the 1996 NEC:

Quote:
230-71. Maximum Number of Disconnects

(a) General.
The sevice disconnecting means for each service permitted by Section 230-2, or for each set of service-entrace conductors permitted by Section 230-40, Exception No. 1, shall consist of not more thank six switches or six circuit breakers mounted in a single enclosure, in a group of seperate enclosures, or in or on a switchboard. There shall be no more than six disconnects per service grouped in any one location.


And it's "substantially and materially similar" in the '99 and '02 codes...

Dangerous? Probably not. Practical? Well, if not having to appeal for a zoning variance due to non code compliance when you go to sell the building is practical...

[This message has been edited by DougW (edited 04-13-2004).]
Top
#108466 - 04/13/04 08:32 PM Re: 10 meters
Lostazhell Offline
Member
Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1248
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
I knew that!
Top
#108467 - 04/14/04 03:42 AM Re: 10 meters
George Corron Offline
Member
Registered: 05/16/01
Posts: 728
Loc: Lorton, Va USA
Guys,
This is quite common in No. VA. The use is for townhouses, or rows of warehouses. The POCO does not (will not) hit them individually, so they choose a common location.

How is it justified???? Why not? Each service has only ONE disconnect (though agreed this one looks as if it may be a bit different), it is only multiple services grouped at a common location.

One of the reasons I don't "pop" on here as much - actually, I do, I just don't answer as many questions- is we do not use the 2002 code, we're on the 99, and I have not updated my class book yet until I know which code we will use. If there is a reference in the 2002 prohibiting this, let me know.

Thanks,

George
Top
#108468 - 04/15/04 10:39 PM Re: 10 meters
Megawatt Offline
Member
Registered: 03/11/04
Posts: 74
Loc: Lexington,Ky, USA
Not really dangerous, very practicle...but still a violation in my opinion. Max number of Discos should be 6...7 if one is used for a Fire Pump.
I didn't see the purpose for the CT cabinet,with individual self contained meters, either.
Probably should've calculated the service, & installed a main Disc. but in My location, the POCO won't allow a Disc. before their meters, this is more than likely how this evolved.
I believe I would've tried to get the building Owner to install a main disc, CT metered, & individually metered the 10, or added an estimated cost to the rent, & included it.
Top
#108469 - 04/16/04 04:05 AM Re: 10 meters
electure Offline


Member
Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4229
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
You cant do that here!
From SoCA Edison's Service requirements:


"A main disconnect shall be installed on the line side of a group of more than six meter sockets,
safety socket boxes, instrument transformer boxes or switchboards.
A main disconnect shall be installed on the line side of groups of two to six meter sockets,
safety socket boxes, instrument transformer boxes or switchboards where groups of switches,
circuit breakers, or disconnects that constitute the meter switch, and the total number of
switches or disconnects exceeds six.2/
The main disconnect may be a fused switch, or a circuit breaker. Where fuses are installed, the
Company is not responsible for their replacement. Main disconnect enclosures containing
unmetered conductors shall be sealable"

...S
Top
#108470 - 04/18/04 07:54 PM Re: 10 meters
electure Offline


Member
Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4229
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
Just another case of Group Metering:




...S
Top
#108471 - 04/18/04 08:37 PM Re: 10 meters
Lostazhell Offline
Member
Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1248
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Electure...
Is this another "Kodak Moment" from your trip into Mexico?
I'm curious if Mexico has ANY type of electrical permit/inspection process? It'd be interesting to see an electrical related accident compilation for down there similar to the one that Bill posted for Ontario Canada http://www.Electrical-Contractor.net/ESF/Accidents/Accident_Summary_Q1_2004.doc

Interesting... But probably a bit morbid!

-Randy

PS Is that an "Urban" meter tree?
Top
#108472 - 04/18/04 09:09 PM Re: 10 meters
Bjarney Offline
Moderator
Registered: 04/10/02
Posts: 2561
Loc: West-Southern Inner-Northeast ...
Another jewel from Joe's Little Shop of (Meter) Horrors at TheMeterGuy.com. [OR]

"Disconnects! Disconnects? We don’t have to show you any steenking disconnects!"






[This message has been edited by Bjarney (edited 04-19-2004).]
Top

Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box

Recent Posts
Looking for older post
by sparkyinak
01/23/17 12:27 AM
License exam
by TRUE POWER
01/22/17 11:33 PM
Members: Non-Members: Did you know?
by Admin
01/22/17 02:34 PM
Safety at heights?
by HotLine1
01/21/17 08:51 PM
International Wire Colour Codes
by Texas_Ranger
01/21/17 03:29 PM

ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals