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#105717 - 07/01/05 06:38 AM Open cabinet with exposed wires
Joe Tedesco Offline
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3325
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts USA
Would you have a problem if the electrician made a blank cover that was the same thickness as this cabinet, and used it as a junction box?

This once enclosed a panelboard.

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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
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#105718 - 07/01/05 09:15 AM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
RSmike Offline
Member
Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 130
Loc: Holland, MI USA
I'd be fine with a field constructed cover provided it was done in a neat manner. The cover and 'reuse' of the box might not meet the code in that it wouldn't be the OEM cover or it's intended use but IMO it would meet the intent. The wires would be protected. Really what's the diffenence between using this box and buying something new. What would be the improvement?

I'm assuming this person would clean up the mess, add some support for the bird's nest entering the box, and perhaps label some stuff.

If it was mine I'd clean it up and put a nice new cover on it with labels, etc. It's not nice and new but it's still functional.

Bring it on....

RSlater,
RSmike



[This message has been edited by RSmike (edited 07-01-2005).]
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#105719 - 07/01/05 12:01 PM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
John Crighton Offline
Member
Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 172
Loc: Southern California
I wouldn't have a problem with a fabricated steel cover having adequate corrosion protection.

I might have a problem with the way the box is supported. There are some cables running behind it, so maybe it's not flat against or mounted to the wall (or whatever that is).

I'd want that top-center KO closed out.

And I'd take a real close look at one of the cables at the bottom, second out from the big EMT. There's something weird about it, almost like a short piece of new armor was spliced on for a little more length.

Then I'd wonder how a romex and BX are getting in through the same twin connector at the top right.

After all of which, the EC and I would have a chat about cable support.

But the cover? Ok with me.
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#105720 - 07/01/05 12:38 PM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
wa2ise Offline
Member
Registered: 11/29/02
Posts: 773
Loc: Oradell NJ USA
Would it be better to use a "super" neutral wire of sufficient gauge than all the separate neutrals? You'd need a terminal bar insulated from the box to land all the neutrals to connect to the superneutral. But if there are circuits from both sides of the 110/220 line in there (likely if it was a panel) currents from one side would get shared at the bar in this box instead of having to travel to the new circuit breaker panel serving this box on one neutral and back again on another neutral wire. Less heat and wire in the big conduit that I presume is feeding to the main panel.
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#105721 - 07/01/05 08:14 PM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
I avoid "super neutral" wires- for the simple reason that you are creating a place where a loose wire would result in the connected circuits receiving 220 volts. Sure, the code allows it, but I prefer to "join" neutrals only at the panel.
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#105722 - 07/03/05 08:22 AM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
Joe Tedesco Offline
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3325
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts USA
The cover?
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
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#105723 - 07/03/05 03:23 PM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4343
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
What about the cover?

Make one out of metal and move on.

Quote:
II. Construction Specifications
312.10 Material.
Cabinets, cutout boxes, and meter socket enclosures shall comply with 312.10(A) through (C).

(A) Metal Cabinets and Cutout Boxes. Metal enclosures within the scope of this article shall be protected both inside and outside against corrosion.
FPN:For information on protection against corrosion, see 300.6.

(B) Strength. The design and construction of enclosures within the scope of this article shall be such as to secure ample strength and rigidity. If constructed of sheet steel, the metal thickness shall not be less than 1.35 mm (0.053 in.) uncoated.
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
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#105724 - 07/03/05 06:14 PM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
mvpmaintman Offline
Member
Registered: 09/15/03
Posts: 113
Loc: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
Shouldn't the entire box be replaced with a listed enclosure and matching cover?
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#105725 - 07/04/05 04:57 AM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
Electricmanscott Offline
Member
Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1478
Loc: Holden, MA USA
What would a "Listed Enclosure" provide that this does not. More money for someone sure but what else. If I never hear listing violation again it will be too soon. Seems to be the hot catchphrase these days.
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#105726 - 07/04/05 06:55 AM Re: Open cabinet with exposed wires
mvpmaintman Offline
Member
Registered: 09/15/03
Posts: 113
Loc: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
where do you stop/start cutting corners?
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