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#102754 - 10/23/06 06:36 PM extra low voltage
frank Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 361
Loc: windsor ontario canada
We have been asked to build an extra low voltage counter and signaling device that would add and subtract much like a parking gate system but count people instead of cars.
I thought it would have to be inspected and approved as stated in rule 2-024 sub-rules (1),(2),(3).The power supply would be a CSA approved but that doesn't seem tho matter(sub-rule 3).Rule 68 page 575 in the ontatio Occupational Health and Safety act also addresses this.
The same person has also informed me that any and all extra low voltage work is exempt from inspection?
I have serious trouble believing this and would like opinions from other licensed guys.
Thanks

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#102755 - 10/24/06 09:18 AM Re: extra low voltage
mikesh Offline
Member

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 614
Loc: Victoria, BC, Canada
Class 2 equipment does not require approvals except for light fixtures which do. Class 1 low voltage or low energy systems do require approved equipment and in the case of control circuits can be up to 600 volts. In BC there is no class of work that does not require permits or is exempt from inspection. The actual policies of each AHJ does vary and some do not require permit for some classes of electrical work or value.
I realize that a lot of low voltage wiring is pretty safe but electrical contractors make a lot of mistakes in installing this type of wiring. They run class 2 wiring in 600 volt MCCs and don't even recognize the difference. Most class 1 wiring must be installed in the same way as line voltage using boxes and bx. I find it hard to believe there is a blanket NO PERMIT required for class 2 and 1 wiring since there is so much potential for gross wiring and safety errors.

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#102756 - 10/24/06 01:09 PM Re: extra low voltage
frank Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 361
Loc: windsor ontario canada
mikesh,Whats confusing me is the wording of
2-024.It does not specify voltage or class and seems to say that whether the parts are individually approved or not once you use these parts to build a peice of equipment it has to be approved as a whole.Maybe I'm reading it wrong.The wording in sub-rule (3) just throws me off.
Thanks again

[This message has been edited by frank (edited 10-24-2006).]

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#102757 - 10/25/06 09:41 AM Re: extra low voltage
mikesh Offline
Member

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 614
Loc: Victoria, BC, Canada
Frank I am confused now too as the CEC has no subrules under 2-024 and perhaps these subrules are Ontario Amendments (I hate amendments)
I will try to expound on the general idea of approved equipment. In your case I expect the need for a product approval or site approval will be related to the control cabinet.
If your controls are supplied from a class 2 power supply and the wiring methods are correct for voltage, condition of use, and type of enclosure as well as wire chosen for location from table 19 then you have all the approvals you require. This assumes the class 2 assembly is not installed in a hazardous location or suplies lighting fixtures. If the controls are Class 1 or normal low voltage then the control cabinet is going to require a site approval from a recognized testing agency who will apply a special inspection sticker giving the inspection athority the OK they need to pass the install. In this second scenario the use of all approved products is also essential. IE limit switches or counters in the field must be in approved enclosures apropriate to the location etc. In other words if you are using an approved wiring method to connect the various componenets together they don't require special approval.
Now if everything you assemble together is made up of approved components and used exactly as they are approved then there is no need for a field inspection. The danger in all this usually lies in the Control Cabinet, if there is one. You buy an empty cabinet and mount terminal strips and install some relays add a few push buttons and a power supply. each piece of the control system is approved but not as an assembly so the field approval should involve a temperature test, Insulation test, bonding test, and an evaluation of the seperation between power and control circuits. If each and every part of the control system comes with it's own enclosure and has been wired as completely seperate devices by a method from section 12 then no site approvals are needed but don't modify any part. If you use a relay and put it in a general purpose box you have created a piece of equipment. If you buy a motor starter enclosure and install their relay block and add the push buttons that are a factory option for that enclosure and starter then the factory has already had the product approved for all their various accessories.

I hope this is what you are after.

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#102758 - 10/27/06 03:23 PM Re: extra low voltage
frank Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 361
Loc: windsor ontario canada
mikesh,yes it is infact an Ontario amendment(my mistake).The rule # is
2-028 Miscellaneous sub-rule (2)
Subject to sub-rule (5) of rule 2-024,any electrical equipment used or capable of being used or adapted to serve or preform any particular purpose or function when connected to an electrical installation shall be approved before being so connected unless the connection is made for the purpose of inspection or testing of the equipment under this code.
Sub-rule (3)
Any electrical equipment that consists of an assembly or combination of other electrical equipment is subject to this code respecting approval,and is not approved by reason only that any or all of the component parts thereof have been individuality approved.

Trying to rationalize(3)but it seems to be missing a word or two?Thats why i think it has to be approved as a whole assembly?
How do you read it?
thanks



[This message has been edited by frank (edited 10-27-2006).]

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#102759 - 10/30/06 04:16 PM Re: extra low voltage
mikesh Offline
Member

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 614
Loc: Victoria, BC, Canada
I think it means more or less what I said in my last reply. this is trying to point out that you cannot cobble together a bunch of approved parts and automatically get approved equipment.
The confusion results in that if I wire my house with a bunch of approved parts (boxes, wire, and devices) I get an approved product. (a House) but if I take an approved relay, limit switch, some push buttons, a power supply, etc i still need a product approval. In the case of a house, the inspection process is getting the approval and the inspector checks that each component is installed correctly and to code.
In the case of a control system the Approval agent from CSA, CUL, Warnoch Hearsey, etc. take a special code book or product standard and perform the required tests for that equipment type and environment. An electrical inspector will just look for the lable as very few inspectors have the instraments or technical data to evaluate stuff in the field.
Short answer I think you are going to need a special inspection for your control system. The manufacturer mau be able to do it in house or pay to do it in the field. Be sure when you order it that you will back charge for any field approvals if the gear arrives without a CSA, CUL, or other recognized approval lable. For our American friends Approved is synonimous with Listed.

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#102760 - 11/01/06 05:09 PM Re: extra low voltage
frank Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 361
Loc: windsor ontario canada
Thanks mike

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