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#100535 - 11/30/06 03:32 PM NEC Trivia Question???
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6805
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Does anybody know....

IF Porcelain lampholders WITH receptacle are not in compliance with the NEC??

IF they are 'non-code' now, WHEN was the prohibition?? (Code cycle please)

John
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John

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#100536 - 11/30/06 04:31 PM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
ShockMe77 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 823
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
I'd have to say that if said lamp holder/ pullchain/ receptacle is UL listed there is no NEC violation.

Now I'll step aside and let the really knowledgable people take a crack at it.

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#100537 - 11/30/06 05:31 PM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
I don't think that there is a direct NEC rule against them- but you can be 'tiptoeing through a minefield' with them.

Like... does the ground pin do anything? Stick one on an old K&T box, and there still is no ground.

Basements and such will still require it to be on a GFCI.

Some places actually require receptacles to be on different circuits from lights, so that might be an issue.

As for attics, where the same fixture will both provide light AND power for servicing equipment ... meeting two code requirements with one device ... well, some AHJ's might thing that's a bit TOO clever.

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#100538 - 11/30/06 06:28 PM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
SteveFehr Offline
Member

Registered: 03/19/05
Posts: 1192
Loc: Chesapeake, VA
I'd say if it's a 2-prong, no, but if it's a 3-prong, it's OK. The problem is that if it's accessible, you can't have a bare bulb, but if it's inaccessible to protect the bulb, it's not much use for the plugs. Also, cords shouldn't be in close proximity to the bulb. So even though the fixture itself might be OK, it would be hard to find a legal application...

If they're not illegal, they should be! I put one in my attic, though. Right above the access hole, so you can reach up and pull the cord. I know, I'm a bad boy, but it's too convenient not to!

[This message has been edited by SteveFehr (edited 11-30-2006).]

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#100539 - 12/01/06 05:39 AM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6805
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Gentlemen:
We are/were having a debate (AHJ's) regarding this item.
One AHJ seems to remember an NEC prohibition (my word) on the recept/lampholder "a while back"

Locally, the consensus is "yea", but no one can pin an NEC year on the supposed change.

I agree, two prong, no; gfi'd ???, and a gray area in an attic as the service outlet and light. Cord on the bulb envelope?? Hey, it's UL; as to the validity of the ground pin?? the tester knows!

John
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#100540 - 12/01/06 06:03 AM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
As we all know, the NEC bans 'keyless' lampholders in clothes closets.

I suspect that, prior to the code actually making that change, some mis-information circulated in the code seminars as to "upcoming changes."

This would not be the first time folks "though" the code said something that it did not. For example, I once encountered some folks who just "knew" that Flammables Storage cabinets "had" to be yellow!

That's why ... whatever your own opinion may be ... code doesn't say it unless you can cite it.
Indeed - and I know this is not often the case - every inspector ought to be able to cite his authorities EVERY time, and refrain from 'shooting from the hip.'

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#100541 - 12/01/06 12:56 PM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
trobb Offline
Member

Registered: 06/08/06
Posts: 111
Loc: Iowa City, IA
Reno-
Maybe start a movement to have inspectors carry codebooks in their vehicle while inspecting?

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#100542 - 12/02/06 09:21 AM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9045
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
Wouldn't leave home without my code book. I also would not talk about a violation I couldn't cite and explain. That is what made the inspector job interesting.
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Greg Fretwell

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#100543 - 12/02/06 12:25 PM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
George Little Offline
Member

Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 1492
Loc: Michigan USA
10 dash 4 Greg
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George Little

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#100544 - 12/03/06 07:33 AM Re: NEC Trivia Question???
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
What about 410.47?
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Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

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