OK if Paul can post a thread about Part P, I can about the problems we have had here with Home-owners taking liberties with their "interpretations" of the 1992 Electricity Regulations.
Since I have been working as an Inspector, it seems that a lot of people mis-read what was in the original document for homeowners.
It seems to a lot of people here that you just go on your own merry way and wire your own switch-board, even though you aren't allowed to.
One place I went to just after Xmas, the lady there told me she had re-wired the house herself, with some help from the nieghbourhood kids.
I asked to look in the roof and under the floor to see if the wiring was compliant.
I was refused a look in the roof and under the floor.
I said that on the basis of the Inspection, her house had failed and would not be being re-connected as planned.
She then said to me that I had no power not to re-connect her house and she would be seeing her lawyer.
I said I have your pillar box fuse in my pocket and it will not be re-inserted until this place is certified to the PoCo standard.
Later that night I was rang by my Boss telling me that the lady had served a Protection Order on me and I was not to return to the premises, or be within 100m of her.
Guys, I am not some sort of flake that posts these sorts of messages, these things really happen.
We have an un-ordinary number of strange people here in Ashburton.
I'm glad I wasn't born here!.

Mike,

Can you point us toward the details of ECP51?

Mike, is that storey true?

This country is going the wrong way with the law on the side of crooks and non compliancies.

If that place required inspection you require access to all electrical wiring and equipment to check if it complied with the regs.

I would also put a seal or sticker across the service fuse to check if it is not tampered with.

Those type of people will connect it up themselves and burn the house down, so you can put the fire out.

Paul,
ECP51

Will open as a PDF file.

{Message edited to fix URL}

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 01-28-2007).]

Ray, that story is as true as I wrote it.
NZ is going down a bad road.
Just think of all the houses that have been "modified" and have never been inspected.
Reason I say that is because, there are quite a few houses here have caught fire because the house has been rewired, but have used the old switch-board.
No upgrade to MCB protection.
I remember seeing a few years back a house that had been rewired and the two aerial wires (both Phase and Neutral) glowing in the dark.
The heat from the pole fuse body was too hot to touch even with Hot gloves and outers on.
A lot of people don't realise how much of a danger they are to themselves and those around them.
A fuse is supposed to be the weakest link in a circuit, inside the house, some clown had installed strands of wire from a 25mm2 cable that was from the guy bringing wire home from work.
He was a plasterer working on a commercial building site.

Mike, if you must post fiction, at least get your scripts correct, then we can all enjoy the acting without the scenery wobbling about.
A Family Court Judge issued a Protection Order, which is for urgent family domestic violence situations, on a complete stranger involved in a petty dispute with a Poco customer - then the Police illegally served the Order on your Boss and not you, the Respondent? <wobble><wobble><wobble>

Protection Order ! Trumpy, say it ain't so !

You can't get a protection order taken out against a PoCo inspector can you ?

This would be a new low !

Something definitely sounds rotten in the state of Denmark..... Er, New Zealand. Mind you, if the judicial system there has become as messed up as it is in Britain, I guess anything's possible.

Oh, and thanks for the link Mike. I haven't had a chance to read through the document properly yet, but I'll get to it!


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 01-31-2007).]

Alan,
It was the Police that served the protection order on me, they are responsible for the issuing and serving of documents like this, people seem to think that you can just make problems go away with not letting anyone that could harm you (financialy or otherwise).
I had a word to one of the Sergeants at the local Police station and he said not to worry about it.
He said he would see that the PO was dropped.
As you say Alan, these things are for real emergencies where people could be harmed.
But, you look also at the people that ring up the 111 system here with diabolical problems but not an emergency.
We are looking at getting a 222 system here to stop these clowns clogging the 111 system up with un-necessary time-wasting drunken idiots trying to call a taxi or thier power has gone off because they haven't paid the bill for the last 4 months.
Good Grief!.

We've just recently acquired a 101 non-emergency number here in a few trial areas to complement the 999 emergency system. It's supposed to cater for the same sort of things as the 311 number which is available in some American cities.
http://www.101.gov.uk/

Having had the document sitting on my disk for nearly a week, I've finally gotten around to reading through it!

Overall, I have to say that it comes across as a fairly good DIYer's guide to general domestic wiring, within the obvious limitations of its size, of course. It's certainly better than many guides of similar length that I've seen here.

With the regard to the switchboard issue:


I can understand why many people will disregard these rules and say "Why shouldn't I be allowed to connect my cables into my switchboard?"

Despite increasing government interference, I think most people in this country still very much hold to the motto of "An Englishman's home is his castle," and wouldn't take kindly to bureaucrats telling them that they can't carry out whatever work they like on their own property. We have rules about planning consent and notification for certain works, but (as yet!) there is absolutely nothing to stop a person doing any or all of the work on his own house.

Anyway, some points arising:


I think demanding RCD protection on all lighting circuits is a little extreme. At present, the U.K. Regs. only require RCDs for sockets which could be "reasonably expected" to feed equipment used outdoors.

If the current proposals for the 17th edition go through that will change to specify RCD protection for all sockets, except those fitted for dedicated uses, but still not for lighting circuits (bathroom excepted).

I think they've got a little confused with double negatives there, but I assume that was meant to say switchboards must be between 1.2 and 2.0m above ground/floor level. Quite a narrrow permissible range.

As noted before, the U.K. equivalent of your TPS domestic cables are solid up to and including 2.5mm. The old Imperial-sized (pre 1970) cables were stranded in all but the smallest size (1./044).

Interesting that running power to each switch location seems to be the recommended/usual method for new work there. That's a perfectly acceptable method here as well, of course, but loop-in by far the more common in domestic wiring.

Speaking of "loop in," figure 4 (2-way lighting) seems to suggest that your 2-way switches have a separate "Loop" terminal provided for the neutral. That would be handy. We just have to connect neutrals in the box with a separate connector on U.K. switches.

On figure 5, socket outlet wiring:

Switched outlets are by far the most usual in domestic wiring here, but not required (switches were required on D.C. mains in the past, but not A.C.).

How about your permanent connection units? Presumably you can use unswitched versions of those for things such as alarm panels or other devices where you don't want power to be shut off accidentally?


O.K., for a moment that main earthing lead size seemed small, but then I realized that in N.Z. this isn't the same as in British parlance, what with you having the main neutral-earth bond in the panel itself. And as I think you know, where PME / TN-C-S / MEN is used as the earthing method here our Regs. don't require a separate ground rod.


Now we definitely have a significant difference. The main equipotential bond here has to be a minimum of 10mm where PME is in use (although 6mm was permitted some years back).

And is it in your rules that the bonding conductor has to be connected to the ground rod itself, or is this just the guide's suggestion? Over here the main bond would normally be connected to the earth bar in the panel, or to an earth block alongside if the latter was between the panel and the earthing point to the supply neutral.

Such switches here are double-pole, but then not all systems are PME/MEN, so the Regs. here have always assumed that to fully isolate an appliance the neutral must be broken as well. Except on 3-phase when the neutral doesn't need to be switched. Go figure.

Re bathrooms:


What is meant by automatic switching? Operated by inserting a plug?

Finally, in figure 22:



That "Kantark" fuse drawing looks like the types which were once common here in some MEM switchfuse units. (The typical MEM "consumer unit" of the 1950s/60s era used the other type shown as MEM in that figure.)

Great post Paul!,
I hope that I can do justice to it in replying.
Paul,
There is not only a safety issue but one of common-sense.
Here in NZ you can't get your "mate" the Electrician from down the road to certify your house for you.
You have to have an Electrical Inspector check all of the wiring that has happened before the Inspection takes place.
One thing that doesn't seem to get through to a lot of Home-owners, is Don't screw the light switches or the socket-outlets to the wall before the inspection happens.
Paul, I can only agree, but you have to figure in the "clown factor" where people will do stupid things like change a bulb with the fitting live.
One thing has to be said about this requirement, it is there for a reason.
Less than 1200mm would cause a problem with flooding here, higher than 2000mm (In a 2400mm stud house)would mean that the chances of the main isolator being able to be opened in an emergency could be less.
Yeah funny thing Paul, in new housing here you will only see proper switch-fed circuits.
In any rewires or where the Electrician (and I use that word loosely) buggered up his quote, do you actually see 3-plating happen here.
Alarm systems are hard-wired here, to their own breaker, usually a 6 or 10 A single pole protecting a length of 1.5mm2 cable.
Oddly enough, you are required here to have a seperate isolator to the one on the PCU as far as Electric Hot Water systems go.
6mm down here is looking pretty shaky these days.
These days Paul, what do you bond to?, plastic pipes?, non-metallic sink benches, plastic baths?.
I'll bond everything in the house, if it is there.
What exactly Paul is lost by not interrupting the Neutral?.
Hmmm.
6mm2, might have been good back in the 1970's and 80's but these days, we require at least a 10mm2 main Earth lead, 16mm2 in some cases.
Thing that annoys me is the way that it is taken out through the building.





[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 02-07-2007).]

I know its 12 months later but if you had the fuse in your pocket what has she done for the last 12 months if you could not reinstate fuse if you could not go within 100m of the person?