Hi Guys,
Just a short question, I am aware that in Europe, you fella's use Industrial plugs that are colour-coded as to their voltage.
What do the colour's mean?.
I think there are Yellow, Blue, Red plugs,
are there any other colours?.
Are these plugs, an IEC Initiative?.
Your input please-

Been a while since I used them but from memory:

Yellow - 110v
Blue - 240v
Red - 415v

I'm sure someone will correct if I am wrong.

Red ones are pretty common in continental Europe as they're used to hook up any kind of 3 ph equipment. As stated in the 400V thread in this forum 400V is pretty common in residential work here.

From Walther Electric:

The voltage, of single rated Pin & Sleeve devices of the IEC 309 type, is determined by the location of the oversized female ground contact relative to the key-way located at the bottom of the housing. A clock face is used to represent the location of the ground sleeve for a specific voltage system. For example, a 3-ph 400 VAC receptacle or connector will have the oversized ground sleeve located in the 6 o' clock position. The corresponding grounding pin location on the plug or inlet is a mirror image of the female device. Devices of mismatched voltage systems simply cannot be mated. Each device is clearly marked with the voltage system for which it is intended to be used. The diagram below show the keying position and the color coding that is associated with each voltage system.

Plugs and receptacles rated 63 amps and above, feature an "electrical interlock" by way of a pilot pin on the plug and female sleeve on the receptacle that is shorter than the main pins. The pilot pin and female sleeve make contact last, and break contact first. The sequence turns the power on when the pilot pin and sleeve mate, and turns the power off before the phase contacts are disengaged. This prevents making or breaking the circuit under load.




[This message has been edited by C-H (edited 11-18-2002).]

Trumpy, if you don't use these: What do you use instead?

Probably the three most common types here are:

1. Yellow, 2-pole+ground, 110V. Used for building-site power tools.

2. Blue, 2-pole+ground, 240V. Used almost everywhere for regular 240V single-phase hook-ups, including campsites etc.

3. Red, 4-pole+ground for 240/415V three phase. Used extensively in industrial work.

Note that the voltage color coding is based on the maximum voltage present between any two poles, e.g. a 2-pole+ground connector for single-phase 127V would be yellow, but a 4-pole+ground type for 3-phase 127/220 would be blue.

C-H,
We normally use PDL-Brand IP56/66 plugs over here, they come in any pin configuration from 3-pin single phase up to 63A 5pin + 2 control pins.
Wan't to know more about this system?
Go to www.pdl.co.nz and click on PDL Products,then click on Industrial, it should auto-scroll across to 56 Series, lots of other cool rubbish on this site.

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 11-20-2002).]

Old 3 ph plugs were a greenish grey or light grey, flat 4 pole type, with equally sized but differently spaced pins. These are most likely to be encountered on old farms and in old workshops. Maybe I can take some pictures and post them.
Then we also had light-duty 3ph plugs with 4 round pins (like on a Schuko plug) in a square and a rectangular ground pin in the middle, widely used in small commercial environments (shops, supermarkets,...)

BTW, does anyone know where a plug with pins like a US 220V plug, but a little narrower and longer and a round ground pin could come from?

Trumpy:
Do Australia use these PDL-plugs too? Are they good? They look sturdy.

(The IEC 309 plugs I've encountered would probably survive a nuclear war...)

Ranger:
That sounds like it could be the same plugs once used here.



These are becoming uncommon since they have a nasty habit of electrocuting people. (They are made of metal) Of a total of seven electrocutions in Sweden last year, two were caused by these plugs.

C-H,
Yes, these plugs and Socket Outlets are made to stand up to all sorts of Industrial abuse,
these plugs, are made to exclude all water, even when hit with a strong jet from a high-
pressure hose, hence the IP66 rating.
We do not use anything, that only would last
5 minutes, in our rigourous Industrial Plants.
They are also a dream to wire, too!

Yes, exactly. Here in Austria at least the receptacle used to be grounded if made of metal (extra terminal screw for just bonding the receptacle casing), but later ones were usually made of light grey plastic. (The concrete mixer at the farm where I usually spend my summer holidays had such a plug, last year it was replaced with a red-grey one, but I think some equipment there still has the old plug.

Ranger:

Even when installed to code, with listings, these sockets are very dangerous. The earth stops working when worn, since it doesn't make proper contact with the casing (or earth "wiper") of the plug. The plugs/sockets are illegal to sell, lend or even give away. Here, the electric safety authority urge you to replace them with IEC 309.

Whew! Didn't know that, I'm not sure if it's as strict here in Austria. Anyway, they're pretty rare by now. I've got 2 old metal receptacles in my junk box. I found them in a cellar along with several complete Diazed panels.

Anyone remember the old Reyrolle plugs?, these were made of cast Aluminium?, and used a Scraping Earth contact arrangement.
They were banned here in 2000, we are still
removing them from Industrial sites, I got a
really good shock off of one of these plugs,
a few years ago, trying to unplug a motor in a glycol plant, in the freezing works, where I was working as an Electrician,
good to see these old plugs banned.

Ok, long talk, short conclusion, our "light duty 3ph plug" is widely known as Perilex plug, rated for 16A.
I saw the old "SEMKO 17" plugs being referred to as "widow makers" or "death plugs" in a german newsgroup (they were phased out in Germany in the early 80ies), Perilex plugs are still legal.
Is it correct that SEMKO 17 plugs only had 3ph + PE? I always thought they were 3ph + N.

>Is it correct that SEMKO 17 plugs only had
>3ph + PE? I always thought they were 3ph + N.

I've seen three pin plugs here, but I think they are intended for 230V 3-ph. Normally, they are 4-pin, as far as I know. (3ph + N + PE)

Stupid question, I just had to take a look at my old ones in the glory box. They have 4 pins, labelled R,S,T and ground, i.e. no neutral, which seems logical, as they were almost only used for large motors.

Ehhh? Four pins, no neutral? Then the earth is on one pin, not on the scrape earth case?

Which reminds me of another question: Does anyone know why much of Europe adopted the letters R, S, and T as phase designations?

Based on the memory of Italian grape-crushing equipment in the 1970s, the leads from wye-delta magnetic starters were UVW and XYZ.

3Phases+Earth, is quite common over here in Industrial work, no Neutral, this is used for 400V motors, wired in Delta, but are still required to be Earthed.
Hence, the four pin plug.
Paul, I think that the RST/UVW directive came from the EU, correct me if I am wrong, but I work now with a Dutch Electrician, he says that the use of these, has been in use for some years?, bugger me!.
Over here anyway, the standard phase rotation,R,W(Y),B, is called L1,L2,L3, in that sequence. :

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 11-26-2002).]

The RST phase designation has been phased out long before EU, nowadays only L1, L2 and L3 is used.
Yes, earth was one pin, but the case had a grounding screw as well.

Texas,
I think that we have had a conflict of terms, here, caused by me.
What I meant by EU, was Europe in general.
Sorry, mate, Kick me, if you must!.

[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 11-28-2002).]

Oh boy, don't get me started! Consider yourself kicked...

Europe "in general" is a collection of countries filled with mostly friendly people whom I have nothing against. On the contrary, there are a lot of attitudes and approaches in Europe that I prefer to the prevailing state of affairs that now exists in England.

The European Union, on the other hand, is a bunch of corrupt, undemocratic, dictatorial bureaucrats who think they can ride roughshod over the rights and wishes of the people of Europe to achieve their aims. They've even suggested that criticism of the EU and its (many) branches should be made illegal! So much for freedom of speech, eh??

O.K., I'm getting off my soapbox and back on topic now....
I've seen the RST phase designations in 1960s documentation on equipment from Europe, so it was in use at least that long ago, before the EU started meddling in electrical matters (before the EEC even became the EU in fact).

Whoa, Paul,
I realised that there was a wee bit of ill-
sentiment from the UK, toward the European Union, but I never thought that it was that
strong.

Uh-oh... With all respect Paul, perhaps we better keep ECN (at least the non-US section) free from politics? There is a rather large chance that we (all of us) share views on matters electrical, but have opposed views on politics. This would be even more sensitive should there come members from, e.g. the Balkans or the Middle East.

Sorry guys, I didn't realize I was straying into the field of policitics. It's just that it sometimes seems that everything the EU gets involved with ends up being an expensive disaster for everyone concerned! The ill-conceived EMC Directive and the "CE" mark is an excellent electrical example.

I didn't mean any offense to any of our members in Europe personally or to their respective countries.

Yeah,
Sorry Paul, for leading you down that road,
in the first place.
I agree with C-H, we have enough politics in our lives as it is, lets keep ECN free of that Rubbish!.

I was probably feeling particularly antogonistic after reading some more idiotic EU regulations.

As I said, I'm anti-EU, NOT anti-Europe, so I hope our Continental friends don't feel that I'm in any way attacking them.

Let's get back on topic.....

Paul,
What type of plug and socket combinations,
do you have in the UK?, for Industrial situations these days.
Are these the same as Scotland, David could you please help?.

Trumpy,
Industrial sockets, are the IEC 309 type (BSEN 60309), still often referred to as BS 4343.
I have not seen the BS 196 type you mentioned in an earlier post for many years.

Yes, the IEC309/BS4343 types are the accepted standard now, and have been for a good many years.

As well as 4-pole+earth 415V (red) for industrial use, the 2-pole+earth 240V (blue) are also found as campsite hookups, and the 2-pole+earth 110V (yellow) are used for the low-voltage power tools on building sites.

Paul,
What type of plastic material, are the bodies of these plugs made from?.
Just wondering if you or anyone else can tell me.

Yesterday I managed to find out why the old 3ph plugs have been banned. The pin layout is symmetric. On one side of the plug there's a key "nose" to ensure the plug is always plugged in the right way. If this nose is broken or filed off (can happen quite easily with the later plastic plugs) the plug can be inserted the wrong way round, turning the ground into a phase.
A second reason is: the pin layout cannot ensure the required clockwise phase rotation.

Those "Ceeform" plugs are used extensively here in Ireland for many applications and are becoming manditory in a lot of situations where domestic plugs were acceptable in the past.

The Red type is seen quite a lot in sweet shops hooking up the whipped ice cream machine.
A lot of commercial kitchen cooking equipment also operates on 380V/400V threephase and uses those plugs as it's a legal requirement to be able to "strip down" a commercial equipment removing all the units for "deepcleaning" of the area.

The blue type appear in many situations where splashing may occur... e.g. commercial kitchens. they're also used as cable couplings for extension cables used for commercial cleaning even though the equipment might be plugged in with a normal 13 amp BS1363 plug at the wallsocket. They're much better able to handle being dragged around after a floor polisher or industrial vacuum and can survive getting splashed safely.

They're also manditory in most work areas.. garages, workshops etc.. etc.. 230 V (blue) or 110V (yellow). Even butchers shops, food preparation areas etc..

Building sites MUST use yellow 110V plugs and 110V isolated supplies. It's illegal to use 230V equipment in such areas. Most powertools, other than those targeted at domestic users are 110V and come with a yellow Ceeform plug fitted.

It's increasingly common to see them used domestically for outdoor sockets. The usual arrangement is a Ceeform socket outside wired back to a flush 13amp / 13amp with RCD spur. All garden equipment is then fitted with Ceeform plugs and trailing sockets. If you need to bring non-outdoor equipment outside you just use a Ceeform plug - normal powerstrip with BS1363 sockets.

They're also installed for christmas light connections on buildings. you'll see the sockets in the eves / on facia boards.

Hospitals are also favouring these sockets as they're more hygenic and can withstand being cleaned down. There are specially approved sterile versions for theatres too.

BS1363 plugs are avoided completely on any lifesaving equipment like respirators, cardiac gear etc as the fuse in the plug is considered a risk. BS1362 fuses aren't designed for non-domestic use and could blow due to normal use, age, peak loadings etc.. so are considered risky. Normally Ceeform or BS546 plugs are used on 16amp radials. So if you see big Roundpin sockets in wards its not coz they're hopelessly out-of-date.

on another point.. BS1363 are avoided in many situations where it would be difficult / dangerous to have to change the fuse.

Theatre lighting rigs (BS546 or Ceeform)

Built-in appliences are often connected to a fused switched spur located nearby either wired straight in or to a BS546 (15amp) socket behind the applience. (or simply have the plug located where it can be reached which is not always possible.) This means you never have to remove the entire applience if the plug fuse blows. It's quite possibile with an applience like a dishwasher or washing machine, particularly in Ireland on 220V where the max load (13amp) for the fuse can easily be reached during the heating cycle on a regular basis and the fuse lifespan may not be indefinate even without any over-current faults.

hi ch :

did not get chance to see ya for long time but i will quickly point it here in north amercica . what you show the "clock plug "chart for varis voltages they are simuiar to north american voltages also and i did look at one of my catalog book and it show the same way of the plugs but you have 3 addtional voltage what my north america book not show on listing but most twist lock plug in north america are colour coded by voltage also bleu = 120 volts yellow = 240 (208 ) volts orange 480v grey 277 volts but i will find more on twistlock plugs but the international pin and plug set up are common for both side of "pond" and of course i remeber the french voltage plug it is the same what you say about it

merci marc

There is a pretty good catalog out there for all types of international Plugs and powercords. You Probably have heard of it, "Panel Components Corporation" see www.panelcomponents.com . Not only does it offer information on power connectors, it also offers information on Country certs and IP (NEMA) ratings

from Trumpy

Mike do you have a photo of these or even one lying around? Sounds wicked from your description! What about the design was responsible for these plugs being so dangerous