Watching TV can be a down right shocking experience!

What year is that TV from?
LMAO

lol. 1980?

It looks like one of the old Philips K9 sets that were popular over here for about 10 years once we got Colour TV.

Those baskets are naff as well!

Alan

Mock ye not!

That old TV was a darn sight better made than the cheap junk in the stores today.

I'd take a TV like that over today's ugly garbage any day.

The loudspeakers were bigger (usually 4" square things), so the audio was pretty good (compared to today's sets with their 2" speakers) and the whole device just...looked nicer.

That TV looks like a late 70's/early 80's....looks like the '82 Zenith we have.

In the 1970s almost all TVs were hot chassis types, that is one side of the AC line was the entire electronic system ground. The antenna was transformer coupled. We did have polarized plugs in the 70s and UL required no exposed screws be connected to the chassis ground. But who knows? And even with a polarized power plug, how many older outlets are wired properly? Black to silver and white to brass - right!

Today switch mode power supplies are used which is offers the same isolation as a 60hz power transformer. Kinda need that with all the grounded input and output jacks in use today but on those days before VTRS and home theater, all you ever connected to a TV was an antenna.

Now growing up I inherited an old 1950s transformerless tube GE portable TV in a metal case with one side of the AC line grounded to it. What were they thinking? I guess on the family room table with no other grounded metal within reach it was safe! And what idiot would put it on a kitchen counter? At least that was 1950s thinking.



[This message has been edited by Gus99 (edited 11-02-2006).]

You have a point there....in 1950 TV was relatively new, so most households only had one and that was most likely in the living room/family room.

Plus did any homes even have indoor plumbing in 1950? Or were people still taking tub baths in the kitchen after pumping the water out of the ground via an outdoor hand pump and then heating the water on the stove?

Ahh ya, Zenith.. nothing but the finest of TV's!!
We have had a few from the 70's and 80's, old floor model ones where the clock appeared on the screen, and even one with a built in telephone!
We still have the one with the telephone built in at Gramma's place too bad the sound amp is pooched.. Fixable I think and hope, but wasn't technology great back then too LOL!

A.D

I seem to remember a episode of "Leave it to Beaver" where the Beave let the bathtub overflow upstairs.. Then him and Wally attempted to dry the plaster ceiling with some old style blowdryer or heat gun... the the patch landed on the dining table during dinner I believe that was from the 50's..

My aunts old 1932 house had a bathtub with legs on it, with running water and drainage... I think indoor plumbing hit metro areas turn of the century.. anyone know for sure?

Hhhmm....interesting.

My mother (born in 1951) said growing up they worked/lived on a farm, had an outhouse, had to pump water from an outdoor pump from the well and had to heat the water on the stove, had to rely on a fireplace for heat meaning when they went to bed at night they had a warm cozy house, but come morning it was so cold you could see your breath...they did have electricity she says....she grew up in southeastern Indiana by the Ohio river.

I don't know if that was the normal way of living or if they were just primitave of the time...

Oh, IIRC Leave it to Beaver ran from '57 to '63 on CBS.

[This message has been edited by Dawg (edited 11-03-2006).]

As far as the question concerning bathrooms and indoor plumbing....geez guys, I was born in '52 and my folk's house DEFINITELY had a modern bathroom, with hot and cold running water, the whole works. Here in Kansas, which always runs decades behind the rest of the country, most cities got running water and sewers by the '20's at the latest. Many had them by the turn of the last century. Depending on folk's budgets, I presume most city dwellers had indoor facilities by the mid '30's. For the farm folks, and that included both sides of my family, electricity didn't arrive until around WWII (1941-1945 for you kiddies), and as soon as it did, the woman of the house DEMANDED hubby install an electric water well pump and electric water heater, which quickly led to indoor facilities.

Talking about the older TV's, it wasn't only them that had a hot chassis. Most of the 5 tube table radios that were dominant in the 40's and 50's had the metal chassis directly hooked to one side of the line, and plugs definitely were not polarized back then. Cheaper TV's had the tube's filaments in series, and did not have power transformers, which would have isolated the chassis from the power line. But guess what? I don't think many of my generation were electrocuted by using our radios and TV's. Agreed, it wasn't the best design, but us boomers survived. Uhhhh, yeah I know many of my generation had their brains fried, but it generally wasn't from faulty electronics designs! GRIN

[This message has been edited by Beachboy (edited 11-04-2006).]

Hmm, nice place for the TV. Might want a Mythbusters Brand Blast Screem there.

I couldn't figure out I'd get shocked by a 1940s wall lamp (plug in.) I took it apart, and whichever side was supposed to be the neutral was hooked to the metal! The plug wan't polarized. More food for the scrap pile!

Ian A.

My mother came from a rather poor family. They grew most of what they ate. Her mom hand made her clothes for her. That's probably why they were still utilizing out houses/hand pump wells/fireplaces in the 50's and probably on up to the 60's.

I've owned 2 old radios, a '47 Delco and a '53 Zenith. The Delco was a wooden unit with plastic knobs and the Zenith is a bakelite unit with plastic knobs....so no shocks here. That lamp sounds rather dangerous....was it hooked up the way it was supposed to be?

The neutral was bonded to the metal base of the lamp, and the neutral wire followed to the socket. The plug wasn't polarized, so if the "Neutral" side was plugged into the hot side of the outlet and you touched the lamp, you got a shock. I just looked at where it used to hang, and the paneling was a bit discolored.

Don't worry, the cord is now in the scrap heap, and the lamp's awaiting a rewire.

Ian A.

[This message has been edited by Theelectrikid (edited 11-05-2006).]

Dawg, those old radios from the 40's and 50's were basically safe, despite the hot chassis design. The problem came when the kids would pull the knobs off and lose them, then everyone would have to use the metal shafts to adjust the volume or tuning. Also, all of them had metal screws on the bottom which attached the chassis into the cabinet, which if you touched, would be "live". As I recall, the connection between the main power and chassis wasn't a hard direct connection, but was though capacitors and/or resistors. I've got several old radios from the mid 40's up until the mid '60's (when solid state technology took over) and collect them whenever I can. My favorite is the Crosley that my dad and his roomate bought together when they went to college in 1945. Can you imagine nowadays two guys having to go together just to pay for an AM table radio?

Man that sounds scary....wonder when they finally started polarizing?

My dad has his dad's old Zenith stereo from about 1960....tube type, record player and all....looks like a piece of antique furniture....reached down inside one day to turn up the volume and got zapped when my hand brushed up against the metal face.

In the owners manual it says if you hear a humming instead of music to reverse the polarity of the plug....

That brings back a distant memory! My grandparents had an old Fisher turntable/stereo deal that opened up from the top (like a coffin) and there was a metal plate around the radio face and knobs.. I remember getting small tingles from that before! It was all tubes in the back (the back cover was missing long before I entered the world.) Over time it was relocated to the garage.. Man that thing used to crank out!

I love tube amps. We use many tube-based preamplifier circuits for high end live sound reinforcement jobs, because theres nothing better. I hope someone still has that unit.

TVs got polarised in 1978 or so.

I remeber feeling something on the metal face of some tube, and other equipment.

When they started polarizing did they polarize all plugs? Or just some?

Folks once had a '77 Sears TV set that was polarized.

I've got a '71 Kenwood stereo that is not.

You think if I polarized dad's stereo no more shocks would happen?

Speaking of old stereo's, check out what I discovered at my father in laws house!







Nope, the cord isn't polarized... But it vibrates the house quite nicely when Rob Zombie is on I'll try to get back and shoot some pics with the back cover off

(edited to put images on ECN server after resizing them)


[This message has been edited by electure (edited 11-26-2006).]

Could we get a pic which shows all of the turntable as well please? I can't quite make out what brand that is.

This looks like the typical radio/tape/record combo unit of the late 1960s to early/mid 1970s era, especially given the "4D" setup which was in vogue at that time.

Those things used to be called "music trunks" in German. They went out of favor in the early 1960s here though. The fanciest ones featured an FM/AM radio, a 4-speed turntable and a multispeed reel-to-reel tape recorder.
My mom made her first recordings in 1967 from her parent's music trunk (only radio and turntable) to reel tape using a microphone because the trunk didn't have any kind of connectors, except MAYBE a speaker plug.

European DC radios were always live chassis, as well as the universal DC/AC types. No polarized plugs in Austria and Germany as well as most other regions back then.
I suppose my 1950s TV set is NOT live chassis, otherwise I guess I would already have gotten shocked from the missing knobs.

Here you go Paul



When I was taking these pics I told my father in law about ECN and that I knew a few of the guys here would enjoy seeing this stereo... He countered "First $500 takes it" LOL!!


(edited to take off of darn photobucket and put on ECN server, after resizing. For the millionth time, Please send them in instead !!)

[This message has been edited by electure (edited 11-26-2006).]

It will cost $500 just to ship it, these things weigh a ton.

Whew, 3 speeds and a record changer too! That's a fancy model!

Thanks! I just wondered if it might have been a U.K. make as I know that several of our turntable manufacturers sold quite heavily into the North American market at that time (BSR and Garrard particularly).

The part I could see didn't look like one of "ours" but I wasn't certain. Still don't recognize it now I can see all of it.

Ragnar,
In the U.K. 4-speed changer decks were common at this time throughout a large range of equipment, from the cheapest portable Dansettes right up to the fancy "radiograms" similar to this one. Of course, the 16 r.p.m. setting almost never got used!

4 speed wasn't that uncommon here either, but changers were rare. I think I've only seen one or two during all the time I looked for old equipment.

pauluk, here in the US, back in the heyday of vinyl (and I hate to admit that I'm old enough to remember it well), the most popular record changers in consoles and compact stereos were BSR's and VM's (Voice of Music). Guys into higher end component equipment usually went with Garrard or Dual. Most record changers were 4 speed, although I never saw records available in the slow 16-2/3 RPM speed. Myself, I have BSR, BIC, and Yamaha turtables, as well as a good collection of classic rock albums from 1965 to around 1980.

AFAIK, 16 2/3 RPM records were limited to "talking books" for the blind, or music recordings for (believe it or not) an automotive turntable sold by Chrysler as "Highway HiFi".

Yep and I think you were only able to get those records for the Chrysler HiFi thru the dealer only, or so I saw on some car show on the tube recently.

A.D

I've never heard of the VM decks. BSR (which, incidentally, stands for Birmingham Sound Reproducers) changers were common in low-end portable units and consoles in Britain, with Garrard being considered the more sophisticated units for higher-end equipment. Garrard also made a lot of transcription turntables and similar high-quality equipment, often used by the BBC and similar organizations.

Most, if not all of the Garrard turntables were fitted with terminal blocks on the motors which brought out both halves of the windings for easy parallel/series connection for 120 or 240V oepration (with suitable change of pulley for the 60Hz North American market).

Collaro was another popular make during the 1950s/60s era for mid/high-end use, and the Swiss-made Goldring-Lenco range was also popular for hi-fi separates (not auto changers).

That's what I've been led to believe too. I've been collecting records for as many years as I can remember, and I don't recall ever seeing a 16-2/3 r.p.m. disc.

I have some old 1950s (American) car commercials on tape, and a couple were plugging Chrysler's "Highway Hi-Fi" record players (for the Plymouth and Dodge ranges, if I recall correctly).

I just assumed that the little decks played regular 7-inch 45 r.p.m. records though.



[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 11-28-2006).]

The original Highway Hi-Fi players were produced from 1957-59, and played the special 16RPM LP recordings only available through the car dealer.

The extremely fine grooves required on a 16RPM LP record made the players a constant headache, and they often skipped and distorted on anything but the most pristine pavement. An "improved" version was introduced in 1960 which played the familiar 7" 45RPM singles, but the requirement to flip records after each song limited the appeal, and it was canceled after 1961.

Lots of info on these things here:
http://www.roadkillontheweb.com/arp.html

Last summer I was a traveling technician in a 1966 luxury railway car.
Since the electrical stuff was constantly giving us hassles I dug into the original documentation.
I found the car once had a special Lenco turntable designed to play HiFi in a moving railway car... it also had an Uher Report reel-to-reel and a HiFi radio. The amplifier was a boasting 8W!
Every compartment was fitted with a Blaupunkt car radio.

Unfortunately the salon equipment is long gone and the car radios don't work any more.

Paul, that picture is a BSR turntable. I have one just like it. I also have the replacement rubber wheels that allow you to use it on 50 cycle. My model is 120v only but they made 220v only as well as duel voltage units. I worked in a TV repair shop late 60's and repaired many of these. Robert

It's funny, because when I saw that deck in the first photo the parts which were visible shouted "BSR" at me. The changer support arm and some of the other features around the rear of the tonearm looked like classic late 1960s BSR, but when I saw the full deck in the later photo the controls and the pickup head seemed to say otherwise. Maybe that was a model which was exported heavily but not all that common here?



Thanks! That makes for some fascinating reading. I see the author is still constructing the Groucho page. A couple of the old commercials I have on tape are of Groucho plugging the DeSoto range, with particular emphasis on Chrysler's pushbutton transmission selector which was the "in" feature at the time.




[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 12-06-2006).]

BSR was a popular record chewer brand here in the USA during the 1970s/80s.

That thing brings back memories I was still using an all-in-one with a clunker like that way into 1997, before I got a real turntable & amplifier.

Lostazhell if you ever get some good pics up of your dad's stereo I'd love to see them.

Depends. Manufacturers back then sometimes had bypass capacitors going from each side of the incoming power line to the chassis, in sets with power transformers. Something like 0.05uF. They were intended to reduce line sourced noise. Some sets have the power switch on one side of the line, and maybe a fuse holder on the other side of the line. With a non-polarized plug, neither side could be expected to be the neutral, and this gave the manufacturer tie points for the transformer primary leads (one on the switch, the other the fuse holder), and thus saved on having to have an extra tie point. Using a 3 prong plug, and connecting the chassis to the ground would be a good solution, but only if there is isolation provided by a power transformer.

In a "hot chassis" set, the power switch was almost always on its ground. This made the wiring dress a little easier, in that there would be no 120VAC (with respect to the local "ground" of the set) around the audio signal wiring (the power switch usually part of the volume control). Also, the switch contacts may act as a fuse of sorts, a fault current from the chassis to a real ground could burn them up and clear the fault, however the switch would never work again. In any event, a polarized plug should connect the neutral to the chassis, and the switch on the hot side. (to reduce any hum pickup from the new switch wiring, wrap some insulated wire around the hot wires, and ground that wire somewhere to the chassis. This creates a shield. Of course, a 3 prong plug is not usable here.

[This message has been edited by wa2ise (edited 12-18-2006).]