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Posted By: bot540 GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/22/10 09:58 PM
I was hoping to get some help here, I recently replaced a gfci that was powering a small pump in a tea brewing facility due to the fact that it was always tripping. I assume this problem may be due to the humidity. Someone happened to call OSHA and now they are asking me for a code reference justifying my action. This pump is not with in 6' of water but is near a few tea kettles. Am I in the wrong here, or does it need to be gfci protected?
Posted By: gfretwell Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/22/10 10:17 PM
Is it in the kitchen?
Posted By: bot540 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/22/10 10:29 PM
See, I don't know if it applies. I just read 210.8(B)(2). It is a production room where they brew tea and then bottle it. Technically I would say it is a kitchen. Is there an exception to this being a dedicated piece of equipment?
Posted By: HotLine1 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 12:10 AM
With a comm kitchen, there are no exceptions for 'dedicated' equipment that is cord & plug connected, 120 volt, etc.

I have to ask, did anyone bother to check the item (pump) that was causing the "trip" on GF? Todays generation of GFI devices usually prevent false tripping.
My experience over many years in comm kitchens, etc. was usually a problem with a plugged in item, and occasionally a 'bad' GF device.

Posted By: bot540 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 12:27 AM
Didn't really check the gfi, it was newer and I'm pretty sure they reported the same problem after plugging it into another gfi. The pump is older, maybe something is wrong with it.
Posted By: Gregtaylor Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 12:31 AM
There does seem to be an interesting interpretation question here. Is the pump in a production area where they brew large quantities, bottle it, ship it out etc. or is it in something like a test kitchen or break area? If the first description is the more accurate, the code doesn't require personnel protection. But determining what a "kitchen" is can be tricky. Is there a set of plans that says its a kitchen? Then its a kitchen. Either way, frankly, if it had GFCI protection previously, it still should.
Posted By: HotLine1 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 01:48 AM
Bot:
Based on your above response, I'd be willing to put a Benjamin on the pump motor has an issue. BTW, who asked you for a code reference, the client or the OSHA guys??

Posted By: gfretwell Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 01:53 AM
The pump problem may be as simple as it is wet inside. Sometime you can fix that by just setting it on the dash of your truck for the day (in the sun).
Posted By: harold endean Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/23/10 01:45 PM
I have seen where OSHA has wanted GFI protection for coffee pots that plug into in a restaurant even though the pot was not in the kitchen. The pots where by the dining area and there was no water around them at all.

P.S. I don't think you want to mess with OSHA they have some pretty hefty fines.
Posted By: ghost307 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/24/10 02:54 PM
The GFI requirements usually pop up where there is water (or potential spillage) present. That's one reason why they are required for kitchen island countertops in dwelling units even if there is no sink in the island (210.8 A 6).
Posted By: HotLine1 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/24/10 03:05 PM
Ghost307:
Taking into consideration the minimal cost of the GFI receptacle, even if it is not mandated by 'code', it is a small investment/cost for the added safety.

Exceeding 'code' requirements will not win a red tag, and avoids any issues with the finished job.

Posted By: ghost307 Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/24/10 07:11 PM
I totally agree. I'd much rather spend the few extra dollars to be safe.

I even install separate GFI receptacles instead of using 1 GFI to protect the downstream receptacles. That way I never have to worry that a single failure could compromise the protection in multiple locations. It costs a bit more, but I can sleep better at night.

BTW, I've only heard of 1 instance where an AHJ rejected an installation because it exceeded the Code minimum requirements. IMHO, he was just being a jerk.
Posted By: gfretwell Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/24/10 10:29 PM
The only problem you can have with the receptacle GFCI in a kitchen is the wash down. Where my wife works they had to switch to breakers because water/humidity was causing the device GFCI to fail prematurely.
Posted By: sparky Re: GFCI Protected Motor, necessary? - 06/28/10 12:13 PM
Just got back from a DIYer wired house (20 yrs ago) where the dishwasher was on a SQ D QO gfci brkr, no big deal

~S~
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