hi, I would like to talk about the PLC with all of you here , I think that the PLC are widely used and as a electrician, we may contact the PLC often. so if someone like to talk about the PLC such as Allen-bradey, I would like to share my experience with him.

Stanley,

I think PLCs are a great thing for an Electrician to know. Years ago, I signed up for a course at a Trade School, but it was cancelled "for lack of interest"

How did you learn about them?

Bill

Hi, Bill,
I learn the PLC all by myself, I have bouht the PLC training books , and I have got the PLC Programming software. so I can study them at home. and also, my company offer me the chance to use the PLC.
it more easier to make your control idea come true when you use PLC.

Bill,
As an instructor in an industrial technology collge we do not like to cancel classes. But the school system sometimes feel like it needs to be a buisness instead of a service. And with the big budget cuts that are in the news these days I think a lot more techinical classes will be lost. We offer a good mix of classes and we try to hold classes even if 2 or 3 people sign up. Hard to justify to upper management sometimes.

Stanley,
Your right more electricians are comming in contact with the PLC. I remember the first one we installed on a job had to hire the programmer to program it, $$$$. Way to go on tring learn it on your own nothing like hands on training.

Hi Stanley,
My "regular" job is as an electrician in a hot strip mill. We've been installing plc's for about 15 years. Started with the GE Series 1 Jr., also the Series 1, Series 6, 90/70 and Allen Bradley/Rockwell PLC 5/15. Some guys in our shop had no interest in learning them but I really like to program. We all learned by doing. It's nice to have a reference book handy but I think it would be hard to learn if it was strictly from books.
I've only worked with GE and Allen Bradley and I like Allen Bradley much more than the GE plc's.
Over the last couple of years, I have been working at the plant's process water treatment plant. I'm the only guy there and get to do all the programming, tweaking things here and there and playing what-if with the code. Like I said, I really enjoy it.
What do you do with plc's?
Don



[This message has been edited by donles (edited 03-21-2002).]

donles
I always liked the GEs better than the ailing-badley. But when they came out with the SMCCC series those were great. I got as far as the A-B PLC-5 series even went to their school but this is about 10 years ago now. The slickest system I've seen was the one A-B installed in the City at the Steel mill for their new continuous castor maching it was a combination of the advanced 5 series called Pyrimid integration system.
If you can convince those guys who dont like PLCs they had better because this is the wave of the future. Alot of places are using PLCs for the ladder logic and PCs for the programs and they both work together for different jobs and types of material.
-Mark-

I worked with PLC's at a company I used to work at using Graysoft software, similar to Modsoft. The input and output modules were Gould (modicon). We used them to control wiremaking machines.

I am very glad to see that so more people here likes to talk about the PLC.
Hi, Donles, I am now seeking for a job related to PLC, AC/DC drives or PC-based electrical control system design, programming, commissioning, troubleshooting and maintenance. I am familiar with various PLC(SIEMENS,AB,OMRON),my last lost job was to program AB slc-500 PLC for different control system. I think that to use PLC good is not a easy thing. some times the PLC are always connected with AC drivers and Operator Panels.and in advanced applications,like Robots control system, it may also related to CNC programming and servo motor control.
all to gether, I would like to tall about these with all of you, to discuss the problem we meet in the work,I think that it would do our good to raise our experience in that field.

I like PLC's as well. I don't know much about them, but our company has installed, and worked on a few. We installed an AB PLC 5. for a conveyor system. Relay logic is slowly becoming a thing of the past. I have a friend who works for a traffic signal company, and he says that all new traffic signals that they install have a PLC in them with a modum so troubleshooting and signal ajustments can be made from a remote location.
Programmable Logically Yours,
Doc

We have bid a couple of jobs with PLC control subbing out the programming. In each case the cost difference to go with PLC was about 30k higher. (the application is motor control for a grain elevator).

In both cases we ended up going with hard wired start/stops.......
this makes for huge control panels that are difficult for operators to learn/understand.

How can we break into the PLC business without breaking the bank?

I am a "techie" and like programming, but I am time and resource limited. I need to invest where I can get the best return, so far that has been running pipe and wire.

GJ

[This message has been edited by golf junkie (edited 03-22-2002).]

Hi all we run every line in our plant with PLC’s. I only allow AB products because of the following; quality, tech support, common platform to learn, ease of programming. And the list could go on AB/Rockwell in my area with the local supply house have many free hands on and lecture sessions through out the year. I attend many the one thing I see is that its mostly plant guys like me. I think that systems integration is a growing field and many electricians are missing out on the opportunity. In western MA there are only a handful of outside resources available. When talking to contractors I urge them to learn all they can or to pick one of their guys and get him/her some training. If you look at upfront cost it may be more but you need to look beyond that a well designed system is much more flexible for future changes and installation costs can be lower that with pipe and wire. AB’s website has lots of good info its worth a visit. If any one has specific questions I’ll monitor this thread and try to reply.
http://www.ab.com/
http://www.software.rockwell.com/

I think PLC's are becoming critical for today's electricians (industrial electricians in paticular)to understand them and be able to troubleshoot PLC controlled systems. I attended a 2-week course in Oregon on the GE Fanuc about 6 years ago. Two years ago I attended a 2 week course on Omron's and likewise on Allen-Bradley. Next....well there's always ABB to go to school on. But my point is that the best way to learn, in my opinion, is by virtue of being an industrial electrician and getting daily, if not hourly experience on production/maintenance support calls. I think it is going to be tough for the "average" commercial electrician, let alone residential, to work with them consistently enough to gain proficiency with PLC's. This experience would obstensibly come under controls, as in controls technician, or industrial automation technician.

to golf junkie:
I do understand what you means , but I think that the PLC's price are coming down and different PLCs have very great difference Price. as I know that, PLC made in US are most expensive, I suggest you can choice some PLC made in Japen or TaiWan or some others else, their prices are much cheaper but the quality are good too. I think that Omron, Nais,mitsubishi should be considered.
as you konw that , it will be a smart electircal panel if you uesed PLC in a motor control system.

Hi Stanley,

I'm an electrician at a large OSB (orientated strand board) factory in northern Minnesota. This factory originally used mostly Square D and TI PLCs (circa 1980), but all but one TI system have been replaced now with Allen Bradley PLC-5/30 and 60 series processors using ICOM software. We will be converting over to RSview soon. Operators control using panelview touch screens, and windows NT/2000 based PCs using controlview.

We also have many Allen Bradley frequency drives throughout the plant. Every processor, freq drive, and programming node is linked together via data highway. The processors message one another throughout the process via this data highway. All of this new technology is tough for an old geezer like me to learn!

Matt

Hello everyone,
I am learning and working with PLCs everyday. I work with them both at school and work. I was just wondering what kind of programming techniques some of you have seen. Such as how interlocks or anti-tie downs are programmed in for instance. We were taught in school that some places will program completely different and that even some engineers will program so that it would take a rocket scientist to figure out what they've done. The way it looks to me that PLCs or some sort of computer automation is the way industry is going. We are even learning at work the Allerton system which is full building automation. Pretty neat stuff.

Chris, there are as many ways to tie interlocks as there are programmers but I will relate my experiences to you. On anti-tie downs we use a timer to make sure that the buttons must be made and opened. Use the ENABLED bit to allow the program to step and the DONE bit to make sure the buttons are not taped down. On interlocks we usually have them inserted in the AUTO operation rung so the machine will not go into operation with an unsafe condition. PLC's sure beat having to meter 30 or so relay contacts to see where the problem is, besides we use a PC to troubleshoot them so I get to play on a computer and get paid for it! Almost criminal isn't it!

[This message has been edited by spkjpr (edited 03-28-2002).]

i once worked for rockwell for about 18 years. the plant was fully automated state of the art equip, at the time. about the time rockwell 'merged' with ab we were installing a new excello fms. so, of course the controls were all ab products. there were 4 plc 3/10's, 2 plc 3's, 4 plc 2's, 18 8600cnc controlled machines, 5 data line displays, 2 asea robots and an advisor monitoring system. all the machines had 6 ac servo drives and a dc spindle drive. and believe it or not the machine ran 80% of it's production. my point here is, with over 8000 i/o you need to know plc's to find that one faulty prox switch.
now there is technology that enables a system like this one to run on a regular pc with built in diagnostics.
plc's are well worth your wild to learn.
thx., ken m

Just found this post and thought I’d respond. I work at a car assembly plant and we (electricians) assist production by trying to figure how to keep assembly lines running. We use A/B PLC’s (5/20’s, 5'40’s, and 5/80’s) to control the operations of our automated lines. We use ICOM software. The PLC is a great trouble shooting aid. Surprisingly a lot of electricians in our plant do not want to use them. I don’t know if they are intimidated by them or what? The company has trained all of us on how to program and trouble shoot. But it takes a lot of practice and hard work to become proficient at it. I personally love using them and use them all the time. Many times it is the only way a problem can be found in a quick and timely manner.

The A/B training and manuals are very expensive! Stanley did your company reimburse you for the manuals you have or did you pay out of your own pocket?

[This message has been edited by MikeW (edited 06-09-2002).]

[This message has been edited by MikeW (edited 06-09-2002).]