I moved into a new apartment. I was happy at first... receptacles 8' apart, all grounded, 2 colors (brown for baseboard, ivory for wall), grounds all pointing the same way (I won't tell which way )

But there is one problem... I kinda overlooked this one too... It still has fuses. I got a 60/40 main/range, and 4 (2x2) 20 amp circuits (wire is 12 gauge). Is there any type of reliable breaker with an edison base, or am I better sticking with fuses?

Nothing wrong with fuses. If you are blowing them you have bigger problems and if you aren't, who cares what they are?
In most respects they are actually safer. Just be sure you always have the right sized fuse for the wire

Make sure there's no pennies behind the fuses either

One of the bad things about fuses is having to keep them in stock. Unless, of course, the circuit continually doesn't overload, short-circuit, or have any ground fault problems. I keep telling a close relative to update the service to avoid having to keep buying replacement fuses but nothing bad has happened, "yet."

At least wehre we run fuses, I do my best to run the correct fuse(s) for the circuit, and not overload that circuit. In my running wth that regime, I have not overloaded fuses, except beacus of equipment or wiring failures.

Wait a sec.... fuses AND three prong receps?

Unless the place was done in pipe- where? the ground? I'd look at that issue a bit closer.

Another issue is the GEC. Fuse panels typically had only a "water bond." Worth looking into.

Now, YES, there are listed breakers available. Made by Mechanical Products, and sold through Buss, they are available in 15 and 20 amp sizes. They have full size bases- no "type S" adapter needed.

Some will read the code as not allowing for the use of these breakers- the NEC only mentions replacing fuses with fuses. In this case, that is WRONG.
I madea proposal on this very issue, and it was rejected by the panel, with the explanation that the NEC DOES allow replacing Edison base fuses with these breakers.

While the breakers are not - last I looked- in the Buss catalog, they do exist. You might even find them at Home Depot, or a hardware store. Buss calls them out with part #'s CB-15 and CB-20, respectively.

Reno, why don't yuou think fuses automatically means no EGC. My house in Md circa 1971 had a 200a fuse panel. We never blew fuses except for when I occasionally did something dumb (bolted faults). I may have used 2 or 3 in 15 years.

Yeah... if there isn't a severe overload condition, a pack of 5 fuses is enogh for years, if not decades. We've been living in a place with fuses for 4 years now, and we blew two fuses (floor sander starting current, somebody thought "if it's only 1.5kW it must be good to run on a 10A circuit... until I discovered the nameplate current of 11.5A running... and the startup draw blew the fuse).

Hey reno, I know what you mean but I have seen grounding systems on fused panels. I just had to re-wire an OLD house in Laguna Beach that had a fuse panel, but what the original (maybe?) construction included was metal device boxes connected together by a seperate, bare #14 that eventually made it's way to a cold water ground. Down the road, apparently another owner changed out the 2-contact outles with 3-prongers, using the yoke-to-box bond as the ground. The ground actually checked out OK, but I would never trust it in my own house with my kids running around in it.

On the upgrade, I drove a rod and bonded to the new copper plumbing, and got rid of the fuses for obvious reasons, but I was surprised like you to see the house bonded at all.

My latest house had an early 60's build date. Ground rod outside, as well as wire to where the water pipe came in the house.

100 amp Federal panel, main, range, dryer, water heater and sewer pump, and then 15 edison circuits.

Outlets all grounded, just that the cloth covered wire had a really thin wire for the ground.

Replaced it when the dryer fuse got hot enough to burn the end off of the cartridge fuse without melting the link.

I think what our beloved Reno was saying is that a range/4 might be suspect in the grounding dept.

TW

Beloved? I've been called worse...

What I meant was the need to check for all this stuff. Yes, there are fused systems that are grounded. Yet, for the majority of the period that fuseboxes were used, grounding was not something anyone paid much heed to. So, when I see three-prong receptacles and a fuse box, I take that as a hint to look deeper.

I own a house built in 1974 with a Murray split-bus fuse panel. It had pullout fuses for the range (50 amps), the dryer (30 amps), the AC (30 amps), and the feed to the edison base part of it (60 amps).

The edison base part of it had held 12 fuses and 11 of them were used.

The only problems with it grounding-wise were that it only had one ground connection to a nearby waterpipe. A ground rod was driven and a new ground wire run to where the waterpump comes out of the foundation.

I ended up replacing it with a Square D QO panel because the fuseholders were in pretty poor condition, and finding replacements proved to be impossible.

I think the builder must have gotten a deal on these fuse panels (which were used all over the development, as far as I know), since the 1975 NEC prohibited their use in residential applications.


[This message has been edited by brianl703 (edited 12-18-2006).]

As far as I know you could put a fuse panel in tomorrow morning as long as all the edison base fuse holders had the proper S adapters in them.

You're right, I think it was the Type S requirement that went into effect in 1975 and someone could have installed the proper type-S adapters in that panel to install it after that date. If the AHJ was ok with it anyway..

From what I understand, my building was built in the 40's and updated in the late 90's (new means 1996, not 2006). They ran new romex but kept the old fuse panels for some reason (former owner/landlord was cheap, had to get it up to date to sell). I opened the fuse box and there are grounds and neutrals in there. The noodle/ground bus seems original too, but it's maxed out (4 circuits).

I have no problems with fuses, and I haven't blown one yet, but my family doesn't always get it when I tell them why they can't run the hair dryer in the bedroom with the A/C running... among other stuff.