i never hardly get job"s without going threw the general contractor. this pisses me off because they make money off me. And usually off the supplies also .And their i am just with my labor price any comments would be appreciated. Im kinda new in contracting guys i need some advice on alot of things i wish i could sit down and talk with some of u about contracting.

I think it's a mistake to allow someone else provide materials. This is one area that you can increase your bottom line. General contractors are entitled to mark up your price to cover their expenses. If you ever need to sub some of your work out, do the same. As far as prices, I would start low, and if you feel you are shorting yourself, GRADUALLY increase your prices. This way, at least your name get's around. If you get every(bid)job, you are charging too little.

so i just go straight to the customer and make a deal with them on materials not the contractor right?

The way I look at it, if I want X amount of money for Y amount of work, the GC can add whatever he wants to it as long as I get my money... You just have to make sure you're including all overhead and expenses...

Unfortunately, mine is a completely cash business (no credit anywhere... not even a checking account) although I'm completely honest taxwise (haven't owed anything yet...) so I'm stuck letting the GC's handle the goods... Since there's no mark-up on bid jobs (and I simply deduct their purchases) whatever's left over is mine anyway...

It's been a tough lesson for me, but I'm slowly getting there...



[This message has been edited by sparky66wv (edited 08-30-2001).]

Stan,

Do you advertise anywhere?
Bypassing the GC would not be a good idea if you don't get any other work. But you can't really hope to get any other type if you don't Advertise.

Bill

I was always told to "sell the job, not the pieces". As often as you can do it, sell your work as a complete job, materials and labor, in a bid or quote. Even to the GC. All GC's mark up their subs cost, mostly to cover overhead and supervision. Try not to let others provide materials, since you can't control the quality of the material, and you can't make any profit from providing it, either.

I was also always told that if you look at five jobs a week, and get more than three of them, you're too cheap. Figure out what you have to have to stay afloat, then add some for profit.

I would try a standard format to bid from. For instance, i have a one page questionaire as to everything i can think of in a single fam home, given accurate info i can give accurate pricing. Bids are done sq.ft, $ per stop, $ per service amperage, etc....whatever works for you , and is in the 'ballpark' with other sparky's in your area. I would take the time to seek out your competition here, as it behooves you and they to be similarly $$$'ed.

Save the T&M for the ones who don't know what they want ( weed them out too, as they are a pain..)

Anyone here will tell you there is no glory in T&M, the pot of gold is in concise bidding. This solid pricing should appeal to a GC who is universally the 'liasion' bettweeen you and the customer. The customer knows what they are paying for,the GC knows what his cut is, you know what your payment schedule is.

One thing i can tell you is that GC's always love the new kid on the block, beware

Cutting the GC out of the middle will result in your getting no more work from the GC. If he's getting you the work, let him put whatever he wants on it. Most customers deal with the GC, there's generally a big mess if they try to put the pieces of a construction
job together themselves.
I'm working on a church that did this. They made a 3 month job last over a year by "trying to save $". The Construction Loan expires tomorrow, it'll cost them big $. They're in deep manure, and still aren't close to completion.

Sparky's right on about the T&M and the GC's feeding on the "new guys". We finally spent big bucks on a commercial estimating program instead of the one I cobbled together in Excel, just to get the standardized concise bidding.
Make sure your jobs make money, and not just break even, either. You can find lots of easier ways to go broke than working hard pullin wire.

Your last sentence sums up my work in 2001...

Been there, done that, '66.

We don't even do new residential for the most part. Can't do the quality wiring I want us to do, and the GC's here force the bid price so low, you have to cut corners to make a buck. I don't like corner cutting; gives me nightmares.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sparky66wv:
Unfortunately, mine is a completely cash business (no credit anywhere... not even a checking account) although I'm completely honest taxwise (haven't owed anything yet...) so I'm stuck letting the GC's handle the goods... Since there's no mark-up on bid jobs (and I simply deduct their purchases) whatever's left over is mine anyway...

It's been a tough lesson for me, but I'm slowly getting there...


How in the heck do you do a completely cash business? No supplier contracts? No nothing? So, you pack that much cash around with you? What's your address again?

What do you mean, "no mark-up on bid jobs"? You don't mark-up anything? Even your time?

It ain't easy!

Not a lot of $$$ to carry around... Rely on customer's to pay up front on materials or buy them themselves...

If I factored everything into my bids, they'd be so high as to be laughable...

What I meant was, once the Dollar amount is agreed on, whatever ain't spent is profit... No markup... in fact, the more materials you buy, the less you make!

General Contractors can be a pain, but remember he got the job and he is responsible for it so he can make the rules. I don't like working for Generals either, I would rather get my own work. I just have to advertise and get referrals.