I am in the middle of another project and I was thinking about using a raceway system but I am stumped about how the Chicago guys get EMT in a wall going through a number of studs. Do they just feed everything down through the top. That will not work here so I think it is good old Romex for me.

Not a Chicago guy but what a do is avoid horizontal runs much as possible. When I had to go horizontal, I'd go through wish a piece of scrap wood that was cut to the height I am going to run horizontally. I'd then go through with a circular saw and make a cut ONG mark and about an inch higher the cut would be just deep enough for the conduit. I'd then go through with my hammer and pop out the piece of wood between the cuts. I would use nail plates to secure the conduit in place.

It sounds labor intensive but if done right, it's quicker then a hole hog and don't have to wrestle the comduit in place.

not all from the top, I drilled the first hole at a slight angle to help me get started, and then just fought it in using the bender at times to nose it in to the next hole. Door openings made it easier too, and I would make some bends once the pipe was in the wall.

1/2" goes in pretty easy… 3/4 not so much, would have to drill a couple holes in the first couple studs to start

I'm afraid that Sparky's approach would get gigged here. I've seen it tried but it always gets a red tag. It's a perfectly good way to get the conduit in place and protected, but it weakens the studs too much to make the framing inspector happy.

When I'm doing new construction I either run the conduit horizontally before the doors are framed so I can stick in a long piece of EMT, drop down through the top plate before the roof deck goes on, or wiggle shorter (36") pieces into the holes I drilled in the studs and used more couplings than normal.

If you're installing a metal raceway in existing construction, you might also want to see if your local Code allows FMT. You get the advantages of EMT but it's much easier to put in.

Best of luck to you.

I have talked myself out of it. The studs are CaC PT lumber and I bet they will eat EMT and metal boxes. I think it has to be plastic all the way. I am even wondering if it will eat the nailer plates, although once the sheathing is up, the nailer plates are not as important.

Does anyone have practical experience with .15 CaC? Are all the fears justified?

Agree, EMT with any PT lumber is a bad idea, probably due to the copper in the preservative. Simpson recommends stainless hardware and fasteners even when the wood will be dry since there could be corrosive elements on the surface of some wood products.

316 S/S would be best where you live, while 305/306 works well at marinas up here,

I am going to do a little science fair project to quantify the PT thing.
I am going to get a bunch of scraps from by project and put a variety of fasteners, Simpson clips and such in them, toss it out behind the shed and look at it in a year or two.

Of particular interest to me are the "hot dipped galvanized" gun nails I have a box of. They are supposed to be OK in the new PT but I am skeptical.

I am using Trex blocks anywhere that metal would touch the PT, just to be on the safe side. Aluminum seems to be the worst. That rules out Bell boxes.

Ill reference it but I do believe the building codes are no more than 25% of the cross section of a load bearing stud and 40% of a non bearing wall joist can be notched or board. Granted local JHA can trump that. I also should have mentioned to make sure by doing what I describe will clear inspection first

PT wood is a whole different ball game

Fron the International Residential Code:

R602.6 Drilling and notching of studs. Drilling and notching of studs shall be in accordance with the following:
1. Notching. Any stud in an exterior wall or bearing partition may be cut or notched to a depth not exceeding 25 percent of its width. Studs in nonbearing partitions may be notched to a depth not to exceed 40 percent of a single stud width.
2. Drilling. Any stud may be bored or drilled, provided that the diameter of the resulting hole is no more than 60 percent of the stud width, the edge of the hole is no more than 5/8 inch (16 mm) to the edge of the stud, and the hole is not located in the same section as a cut or notch. Studs located in exterior walls or bearing partitions drilled over 40 percent and up to 60 percent shall also be doubled with no more than two successive doubled studs bored. See Figures R602.6(1) and R602.6(2).
Exception: Use of approved stud shoes is permitted when they are installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s recommendations.

I'll have look up the IBC in the office tomorrow

Since my wall is not nailed up yet (no SS nails) I am going to pre drill them right smack in the middle for smurf tube
(1" leaving the 1.25" of good wood on both sides)
The smurf will be squeaky tight in 1" holes but it should go in OK. Then I can have my raceway and still be plastic all the way.

If you wiggle the drill while boring the stud you might be able to get the hole just a teeny bit larger than 1" and have an easier time pulling smurf tube into it.

Happy Smurfing.

IBC notching and boring in wall studs:

IBC 2308.9.10 and 2308.9.11 respectively.

notching 25% load bearing, 40% non-bearing.
boring 25%/60%

Greg...

This Old House had a single series dedicated to remodeling a Chicago code home.

The general style:

Lots of vertical drops -- strapping, per the NEC, was highly optional. (!)

The framing would normally be stepped out from any basement wall -- typically 1.5-2.0" so it was no trouble to get your horizontals across, in a flash.

In the ceilings, it was customary to provide cross-furring so that there was every opportunity to run pipe in one gap or the other -- with strapping an absolute breeze.

When it was impossible to get the pipe back from the surface, there was no hesitation to throw in the occasional stick of GRC/RMC.

The relaxed strapping permitted the EMT to fly into the home.

In the case of the remodel, the actual scope of pipe work was stunningly modest. They simply added on a run, here and there, and then ran new wires. For the runs involved, the old work became pull lines -- and then scrap.

So no fishing time to speak of. They were big into stranded, too.

Only rarely did the boys run anything bigger than 1/2." In a three wire system you can get four hots and two/four neutrals in one pipe. These are short runs, and the number of bends is modest.

The consequent speed of these pipe runners is astounding.

The additional thicknesses of the various walls provides for more insulation -- of which Chicago can certainly use.

I went with the Smurf.

http://gfretwell.com/ftp/Deck%20going%20down.jpg

We are putting down the $2k worth of Ipe decking this weekend.
It is what happens when you give the wife a choice of samples

Greg,

I think we have spoke before, you should NEVER EVER allow your wife more than 1 or 2 choices!

All though I know who rules the roast around my house. (her)

SWMBO She Who Must Be Obeyed.

I was an easy sell, I hate Trex and we got a bunch of Ipe cut offs from a dock they were building in the bight in Key West.
(we packed it home on the ferry)
When we were deciding I brought her a piece of trex, a piece of the solid plastic and the Ipe. I was happy she took the Ipe but I still griped about it

Now that I am committed, I am using the Ipe for the sills and I am building a small bar top from some. I did get a deal on a 10 foot stick ($20) because the edges were not finished but I am jointing it anyway so I a happy guy. It is $5.50 a linear foot normally.

I am really surprised the smurf is not more popular tho.
It gives me all the benefits of a raceway system without a cost much more than Romex.

Greg...

Out my way it is simply PROHIBITED for power wiring.

It rules the roost for low voltage chases.

It's that simple.

BTW, I can't believe that you got so lucky with the ipe 'buy' --- did you use a gun?

For those unaware...

Ipe = IRON WOOD -- it's so heavy it can't float. (!)

I used smurf piping before and it goes in relative easy. I have had it break inside the wall and come out of the fittings after the wallboard has gone up. It's not the easiest to pull wire through with a fish tape.

It kinda strikes me funny that you can't knotch the studs although yet smurf offers less protection to the conductors the Romex sheathing. Some juristdictions

The first time I ever heard much about smurf it was from a Carlon guy doing a road show for inspectors. One thing he made a point of saying was that you need to hear 2 clicks when you snap on the connectors. If they bite 2 corrugations, they are not coming apart.

I do find it interesting that they amended around article 362 in California.

I am also curious why people think this offers inferior protection than Romex. For example you can use ENT in steel stud punch outs without a grommet. (although it is tough to pull through)

Greg,

Around here the smurf tube isn't too popular either. I don't know why, but most EC's will use RX in houses, PVC in ground, EMT where subject to physical damage. Almost never see EMT inside closed wall construction around here. Maybe they will use MC or AC, sometimes I see smurf for low voltage but not a lot of it there either.

I really came from the commercial world and I appreciate a raceway. Romex is fine if you are sure that is the last thing you will ever want before you nail up that wall.

Did I ever tall you about my wife?

I like being able to say, no problem honey, I will shoot in another wire if I need it.

I know of at least one (significant player) EC that does not ship 12-2 to commercial jobs.

They, by policy, run only 12-3.(!)

This solves the need for the occasional extra ciruit in a stud wall. It bails them out of partially damaged cables -- a constant bane with the hacks out my way.

It also permits much dumber/ greener troops. Cable becomes just cable. There's no way they can install the wrong stuff.

The way they build up their D&B circuits drives everything towards 12-3 -- as against 12-4, which they shun.

If the job warrants, this rule is broken. (large tight bid)

It also permits them to stay 'on color' -- in the main. C phase loads are shifted to as many piped runs as possible, particularly back near the panel. Staying mostly on color makes circuit de-bug much quicker. Green troops are normally confounded by the idea of phases -- no matter how slow the instructer goes. They have to do it with their hands and over time finally pick it up. (Or maybe not)

You can run 10, 12/3 and someone will bunk it up. I'll put money on it...

Now you're talking odds.

You're right, of course. Somewhere out there someone is going to screw the pooch.

But, typically, the 12-3 cable is going to carry the day.

The contractor I'm talking about has done ALL of the calculations -- and concluded that 12-3 it is.

Take that for what it is.

I'm not questioning you. Wasn't my intention.

Finished wall, Greg?
The guy I was paired with when I first started my time, insisted I worked with 3/4" steel conduit.
In a house, this was in the late 1980's.
What we had back then was really strong arms and what we did was bend things a "bit" at a time, check it, if it looked good, we sent it up the wall.
Horizontal runs of anything back then were pretty much frowned on.
But then the TV aerial installer would come in and blast an RG-59/U co-axial cable across the same wall you'd just run steel conduit.
Sometimes they'd even knock a whopping great hole in the wall, to bond off our conduits, after the plasterers and painters had been in, of course.

This will be covered with T1-11 and then split bamboo. (at least the current plan. I think we are on plan #3 right now.