ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
Safety at heights?
by gfretwell - 04/23/24 03:03 PM
Old low volt E10 sockets - supplier or alternative
by gfretwell - 04/21/24 11:20 AM
New in the Gallery:
This is a new one
This is a new one
by timmp, September 24
Few pics I found
Few pics I found
by timmp, August 15
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 183 guests, and 25 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Thread Like Summary
sabrown, tortuga
Total Likes: 3
Original Post (Thread Starter)
#222443 01/09/2024 1:18 PM
by renosteinke
renosteinke
Just got an e-mail cautioning me against buying "counterfeit code books." That's an interesting concern!

I, for one, am a firm believer in knowing your code. That means (for example), if you're in Chicago, you have the City of Chicago Code. Since "the law" is public domain, I have no problem with going to the City web site, downloading, and printing off the code for free. Or, alternatively, going to the bookstore and buying a nicely bound copy of the City code.

BTW, that's exactly what you do when you want a copy of your power company's standards.

What is the NEC and who are the NFPA? The NEC is but a "model" code, written by a private publishing house. The NEC isn't "the Code-" it's simply a template, a long list of suggestions. No one elected the NFPA into authority, the NEC is written completely apart from the legislative process, and can be best thought of as one novel that you'll never see made into a movie.

I've seen all manner of items sold on street corners, or unloaded from Chinese ships. (Remember the "Bolivia" watches?) Yet I've never seen a "counterfeit" NEC. Heck, now I might be inspired to write one -- call it the "Eclectic" code. Mandate receptacles that look like smiley faces. Require panels to have drink holders. Require square wires, because that's how we measure cross section.
Liked Replies
#222444 Jan 9th a 04:59 PM
by gfretwell
gfretwell
I think we all understand the NFPA is a government mandated monopoly that makes it's money by printing books every 3 years. There was a court decision that made them put the NEC on their web site for free but that doesn't mean it is easy to use there or that you can copy it. I agree that as soon as something is adopted as public law it should be freely available but that is not the case with any NFPA standard and the NRTLs are even worse than that.
It is a huge money grab by people who print these books. It is also why we have so much code "churn" in the name of safety. NFPA should have their codes on a 10 year cycle but they wouldn't make nearly as much money.
It is really stupid that they close the ROP before most AHJs have even adopted the last version. Because of legislative inertia and the timing of Florida codes vs NFPA, Florida is always at least one cycle behind, most of the time 2. We are writing new code before anyone has any experience with the current one. It is also worrisome about how many manufacturers sit on the CMPs, pimping their latest research project to be in the code. There is no better example than Cuttler Hammer and the AFCI. They had that rammed into the 1999 code (to be implemented 3 years later) before they even had a working model. I got that straight from Harvey Johnson who was on the development team. Square D was forced to rush a device into the field that didn't work and had to be recalled, I bet half were never replaced. That device was literally beta tested in the customer's home at the point of a government gun.
1 member likes this
#222467 Jan 11th a 03:41 AM
by gfretwell
gfretwell
At the price of the real book and the cost of production once they are scanned, I am shocked it isn't a bigger thing.
Even if you printed it on a homeowner laser printer at a dime a page it is $90, cheaper than the real thing but they are probably using an offset press banging them out at a penny a page. Put the 3 hole punch die in that press and you have a loose leaf NEC for less than $10. In Asia, that might even be half of that. If the printing is blurry or the image cock eyed, it just means the guy making the plate or mounting it was sloppy.
I worked on an offset press IBM marketed in the 60s that made this exact book at 25,000 pages an hour. (two sides, one color, 3 or 22 hole punch). It was fed from a roll of paper 3 feet in diameter and cut sheets at 8.5" (letter or "legal"). It was designed to produce our technical tips and we bought the rights to market it.
1 member likes this
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5