ECN Forum Forums Code Related Discussion NEC & other Code issues Lets Talk About Screws Some More

My bet is since that screw is the only screw in the box its probably a sheet metal screw used to mount the box.

You are an inspector of what? Obviously no electrical inspector or you would know that that is a 10/32 ground screw and green at that. No, it is not listed, I don't even know if they would list common machine screws.

Somebody propose to the NEC that this be clarified so we don't have to hear this anymore!

-Hal

For years proposals have been made to the Code to get the panel's official interpretation without going through a formal interpretation.

Make a proposal to the 2008 Code to require wires to be wrapped around screws in a clockwise direction or to require a green listed screw be used. The proposal would likely be rejected with a panel statement. The panel action and statement is now an official interpretation.

I'm not color blind and that screw doesn't look like a green grounding screw to me. What do you say we ask Iwire (who posted the picture) to take that screw out and take a close-up picture of it, then there will be no room for argument(of course I enjoy a good argument as well as anyone, hey, thats why I'm an inspector).

Kalbrecht I hope you are looking at a black and white monitor.

Yes this is a "Ground Screw" if there is such a thing.





Yes the label calls them ground screws but they are not UL listed.

I challenge anyone to show us or tell us where to find UL Listed ground screws.

They do not exist that I can find.

I'm not color blind and that screw doesn't look like a green grounding screw to me.
Believe me, it's as green as the wire. Adjust your monitor properly.

Make a proposal to the 2008 Code to require wires to be wrapped around screws in a clockwise direction or to require a green listed screw be used.

Not at all what I was talking about. I don't care which way the wire is wrapped and neither should the NEC (although it should be wrapped the other way).

What I'm saying is that section 250.8 is not complete and misleading.

The most common way to attach an equipment ground wire to a box is with a screw. Most times it is the only practical way. Section 250.8 prohibits sheet metal screws for this use and by implication allows a machine screw.

As I said, I don't think something like a machine screw can be listed and if it is the Code's intent to allow its use (as we all believe it is) 250.8 needs to be changed to clarify the intent. Even a FPN would do it.

-Hal

OK is this a violation?

This is a lug rated 1/0 to 14 AWG and is fastened to the box with a standard 1/4" x 20 nut and bolt.



Yes I know the lug is a little large but it is all I had handy and it is rated for that size wire.

250,148(A) states grounding screw or listed grounding device. Looks like a discrepancy in the code. Either should be ok

[This message has been edited by kalbrecht (edited 05-21-2004).]

Since the term "grounding screw" is not defined within the NEC, it's my intepretation that the term is used simply to clearly define the function of the screw. That is, any screw [except sheet-metal, of course] used solely to maintain continuity between a EGC and the box is by definition a "grounding screw".

That being said, I'm set in my ways: I always like to use the green screws, and I've actually moved EGCs out from under cable-clamp screws just to put them under a green screw.

Same applys with putting conductors counter-clockwise under screws; it's not wrong, just not how I do it.

-John

[This message has been edited by BigJohn (edited 05-21-2004).]

This is definitely NOT a violation. This isn't part of an electrical installation and the N.E.C. doesn't govern paper-weights. If it were part of an electrical installation, I'd be much more concerned about the missing side of the box!

Dave