ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area inspectors

lamplighter, is it possible that this is or was a union rule? When I was approached to be organized we discussed something like this, but I was under the impression it was terms of the union contract. I have yet to hear of an inspector carding someone. It doesn't sound like a bad idea. If it were to be a state sanctioned requirement I would hope it would be a state issued card, but anything to keep the quality standard and pay standard high sounds good to me.

This is something addressed by your local codes. Some states (Oregon) have state-issued cards, while other places (Reno) have them issued by the city.
I worked for years with the local inspector carefully not "seeing" me work. Finally, one day, he asked to see my card. He almost fainted (from shock) when I produced one; it seems it has been rare in his experience for someone to get the card before they're first 'caught!'

Any apprenticeship program ought to issue some sort of "card" or "diploma" that attests to your completing your work. I would ba amazed if an electrical contractor hired a "journeyman" without asking to see this paper.

OK,
When I first topped out in Broward county (completed my apprenticeship)I had to go take the Broward county journeymans exam in order to be legally qualified to work without the direct supervision of a journeyman electrician on site.
It was a legal requirement in Broward county Fl.
I got the license at the age of 24 and was then considered a qualified electrician in Broward county.
I was legally allowed to work thoughout the state with that county issued license.
The Ft. Laud inspectors were sticklers for the card and I was required to have it on me at all times when working with the tools.
When I moved to Michigan in '97, the laws were pretty much the same but shortly thereafter, the State took over the exam and the licenseing.
I just looked the law up when I started this thread and in Michigan, an electrician must hold a journeymans card in order to be legally eligable to work in this state.
The fines are as follows...
Not less than $1000.00 per day for each day the violation occurs except that the fine shall not exceed $5000.00 in total per violation.
A second or subsequent violation is punishable by a fine of not less than $2000.00 per day for each day the violation occurs except that the fine shall not exceed $10,000.00 in total per violation.
This is part of the Michigan Electrical Administrative Act # 217 of 1956.
The licensing requirements under this act are section 338.888c paragraphs 3&4.
The law states that an id card not larger than 3 1/2 by 2 inches which shows the class and year of licensure be issued to anyone licensed under this act and that anyone working under the provisions of this act be able to show an inspector, upon demand, this card and a picture ID within 24 hours of being asked or the contractor shall be held reponsible for the above fines.
What pisses me off is that the legislation is already on the books and yet I have only been asked to show my card once in this state since I moved here.
No one here seems to be protecting the trade from the guys who don't have the expertise or the time in to pass the test.
The Union electricians here don't need to carry a J.L. since they apprenticeship is a good training program here and the locals have lobbied for the right in the past but, the non-union guys are supposed to have this card and no one seems to give a damn.
It's hard to compete by the book against other contarctors who might be hiring their guys out from behind the Burger King counter when the authorities having jurisdiction aren't enforcing this law.

Sorry, I'm starting to rant and rave a little.

Your thoughts?

And I thought it was about safety.

Around here inspectors are doing 30-40 a day. I doubt they have time to look for any card, even "la mica".

I'm from NJ also, and the way it was explained is "the way it is".

I have my EC lic. and my BP (up to letter "C"....soon to be "D" due to me moving ~ but the company name remains the same). Issued 1993.

I also carried the fabled NJ State issued "Journeyman Card"...for about a day...I saw NO POINT in keeping it "handy". Issued 2001.

If you guys want to see what one looks like ~ maybe I'll post a pix so you can say "I saw one - it's not a myth." LOL.

FWIW....most inspectors seem to "qualify" you the moment thay set eyes on you. Things like tool belt size and number of trips up the ladder or work plan are used as indicators as to whether the job is being run by someone who knows what they're doing.

Gentlemen:
Our Board of Examiners are the ones who impose fines on the "Un-Licensed".....
There's a 'Board' for EC's; Plumbers; Architects; Doctors; ETC.

Usually, on the NJBOLEC website, they have a posting of the 'minutes' from the previous meeting, with the fines paid, and other things. If I can patch the site link here, I'll try.

I don't want to enter any facts, names, locations, etc., here, as 'inocent until proven guilty prevails in my book, but I had an incident about six weeks ago, and I'm waiting for some news.

John