ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area bonding the neutral

Morning all, thanks for the vote of confidence Bob.

First of all I think I see some of the misunderstanding.

If we go back to my first post where I said (I actually drifted from Rizers direct question here) my intent here and in my other posts have been that, baring this, (and of course other outside paths) there would be no common conductive path be it intentional or not, think wooden structure, and Bob's reference to Exception 1 to 250.30(A)(1)


With that said, I wholeheartedly agree that if we do identify a parallel path in any form, the wiring method should be modified to eliminate it.

Rizer, in your last question you could treat this the same as the right hand diagram and eliminate the green wire conductor shown. The bonding bushing would only be necessary on one end, with the other bonding jumpers as shown.

Rizer, I also apologize for the added confusion to your question.

Roger

[This message has been edited by Roger (edited 03-21-2004).]

Rizer, I just noticed you are in Btown, I was born there, and still get down there once or twice a year.

Who are you working for?

I worked for quite a few Bradenton and Sarasota companies in the 70's and 80's, to name a few, Parrish, Pearson, Bridgeman, Dixie lighting, Otis, and Lantern.

I don't know how many of these companies are still in business and do know some are not.

Roger

Roger
When it comes to the theory and technical ends of this business, you have a wonderful knowledge level - hence your posts on this topic are confusing me as to how I understand the theory and code rules for a transformer installation within a building (SDS).

As exception 1 to 250.30(A)(1) would seem very restrictive (almost an arbritary inclusion to this section), I have had the understanding that treating a SDS in a building is much more restrictive than treating a service to the same building. As in not permitting the bonding in both the transformer and the first point of disconnect. It would seem to me that the bonding and grounding performed at the transformer would be the only place permitted (in actuality) and separating the equipment ground and the neutral at the first point of disconnect would be mandatory or the bonding and grounding at the disconnect, but not at the transformer - never at both for this installation. ... Am I incorrect in this thought process?

Pierre

Pierre, thank you for the complimentary words.

I like the way you put this.

You are absolutly correct and I agree. This will be the last time I bring this up.

Even though the exception allows this, it would be a rare situation where it could be used, and by me bringing it into the "allowed by exception" limelight
I am confussing others and potentially creating some possible violations and or dangerous situations.

Now, let me say that I agree with all of you, and due to the rare situations where bonding at both locations could be done per 250.30(A)(1) exception 1, I think it would be advantagious to remove this exception from the NEC. (If for no other reason but to keep me from confussing people. )

I appologize to all and especially Rizer.


Roger





[This message has been edited by Roger (edited 03-22-2004).]

roger, i work out of the lu 915. i have worked almost exclusively for dale c. rossman electric at the bradenton tropicana facility. i apologize for not reading your responses sooner but i have been working on a "shut down" and as the forman on the job and have had to see it through with all the inherent headaches (like 3 revisions in threedays from the engineer). I cut my teeth in the non-union sector in 5 different states across america. when i moved to fl. it became apparent that i would have to join the union to get even close to the pay i was used to. by the way its still beautiful during the winter and hellish during the summer. just 2 more weeks till the snowbirds leave and traffic returns to normal.
during the five years i have worked on projects at the tropicana plant i have had the opportunity to learn a great deal about industrial electric and would never(if i can help it) go back to the commercial end of the trade. the constant repetition and wear and tear of commercial work has taken its toll on me.
i would like to thank everyone who has responded to my questions.
thanks again!

[This message has been edited by rizer (edited 03-27-2004).]