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Joined: Oct 2000
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The UL Directory under the subject of receptacles includes the following statement:
"Screwless terminal connectors of the conductor push-in type (also known as "push-in-terminals") are restricted to 15 amp branch circuits and are for connection
with No. 14 AWG solid copper wire only.
They are not intended for use with aluminum or copper-clad aluminum wire, No. 14 AWG stranded copper wire, or No
12 AWG solid or stranded copper wire."
Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,236 Likes: 1
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Gosh fellas... I'm embarrassed, I apologize for going to far with this...
The stress of trying to get this music festival miracle accomplished is driving me bananas...
I never intended to take it out on any of my friends here...
Mr. Hixson first ingrained into my thinking that back plugging was a very bad no-no...
I've encountered about a half dozen failures in these receptacles... They're easy to "fix" too, just remove the recept, wiggle the wire and presto! put the recept back in... but the corrosion over time from the weak joint will rear it's ugly head again... Maybe not so quietly the next time... It will get worse with every "fix"... Who knows how many countless DIY'ers "fix" these type recepts in this manner.
Plus with the usual 47 other questionable techniques that usually go hand in hand when I see them (Circuits overloaded with extension cords everywhere, etc...) seem to complicate the matter.
-Virgil
Residential/Commercial Inspector
5 Star Inspections
Member IAEI
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,294
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Virgil,
AJ always referred to them as a "piece of ****"(junk), and I still agree.
I've taken out lots, and replaced w/ real recps. These were in res., comm & ind apps, high load, low load.
Quality is in the eye of the beholder.
Does anybody stab @ home?
(apologies to any of you "supercompetitive" residential guys)
I've not yet had to replace a screw-terminal recp because of anything other than stripped or loose screws (bad install) or an outside influence
[This message has been edited by electure (edited 08-01-2001).]
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Joined: Oct 2000
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I second the vote electure;
callbacks are something we eat.
I pigtail everything...
Also, anyone ever read 'UL corner' ?
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,116 Likes: 4
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Sparky,
Why don't you share with us?
Bill
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Joined: Mar 2001
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I forbid any of my employees to use push-in connections. How ever I like to thank all those electricians (and others) who use them, I can tell you that we have made Hundreds of service calls ($$$) over that last 25 years trouble shooting & redoing these failed push-in connections.
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Joined: Oct 2000
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ok Bill, but ya know what goes down when ya let me off my leash ![[Linked Image]](https://www.electrical-contractor.net/ubb/smile.gif) UL corner is an IAEI article Imagine yourself one of the OSHA sanctioned testing labs. You are in the biz of passing judgement on manufactured goods. The testing you do is in a laboratory setting, and the variables addressed are not those that necessarily are seen in the field. This is the ultimate gamble. Factor in the maufacturer's insert child labor from third world sweat shops that could easily choose 16 compeditors here, and said gamble up's it ante, right? Why else would #12 be out, and #14 ok? as one poster eloquently phases it 'body count'
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Joined: Mar 2001
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Reminds me of the last time this happened (what was it now, whether or not to pre-twist wires?).
My conclusion... some will, some won't!
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,116 Likes: 4
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Sparky,
Re: #12s not being supported anymore.
I assumed that it was determined to be an inadequate connection for the loads that may likely be encountered (or, that cannot be avoided) on 20A circuits. (I'm not clear on the last half of your post)
What I was wondering is if there was a specific article that you were referring to that had info on this subject.
Bill
Bill
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Joined: Oct 2000
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Bill, There was an article, way back, i doubt i'll find it in my stack of mag's. My point is the rationale for outlawing #12's and accepting #14's has comprable integrity to claiming 2 bullets in the chamber is safer than 3 playing russian roulette. The trade has seen loose connections at every load status. Testing lab's are nothing more than a 'liability' kicking post for the trade , AHJ & end user to point to. They should not be considered the advocate of quality, which is evident in Consumer Reports and similar periodicals that regularly trash 'listed' goods.
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