ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area $250 contactor bill, $3000 A/C motors...A/C is a racket!

i think i figured something out.

since people off the street are not able to price (or buy) heating and cooling appliances without a license, customers have no idea of the actual cost of them. its not like you can go to home depot to get an idea of prices.

so contractors only have to worry about the next guy's quote and he isnt likely to give out that kind of info either.

now, if lowes and home depot would only quit selling electrical supplies.....hee-hee.

SERIOUSLY???!!

So that means if the blower motor on my window air conditioner goes ka-blooey I can't go to an AC parts shop and buy one? Wow...

Then again....window air conditioners are probably not fixable anymore...

Then again it's a moot point because AC and furnace repair (except for maybe some basic, easily replaceable electrical things that don't involve the freon gas & compressor) are not my specialty.

Still it seems weird that you need a licence to buy .... say a new gas ring for your furnace?

This is why if your A/C breaks down you just chuck it and buy another. Unless you've got central air, it's just not worth it to get it fixed. Of course, if you do have central air, then you have little choice but to eat the cost.

MacWire

i guess i should have said 'equipment' instead of 'appliances'. i'm sure you can replace a motor on anything they sell at home depot, but if you want to buy a new gas furnace or a central air conditioner, forget it.

I do alot of AC work. That contactor...for a residential unit probably cost the contractor $35.

And anybody can buy A/C parts from many sources such as Johnstone Supply. You only need the license for the refrigerant.

And a $3K motor, never hear fo that. What motor are we talking about, condenser fan motor, blower motor, or compressor? I buy compressor motors for between $200 and $400 usually. I have paid $4K for a big one. I get wholesale prices.

And in my opinion, these guys usually deserve the money they make. They have to understand electricity as well as an electrician (sorry for saying that) because they need to troubleshoot everything from power supply problems, to control circuits, have to be at least half way decent tin knockers, understand some solid state electronics, be excellent plumbers, be riggers when placing or building big installations, and in addition to all this they need to know their own trade very well.

There's alot to know and a good HVAC tech is harder to find than a good electrician. Supply and demand at work.

for several years we have been required to take yearly classwork in order to renew our electrical license here in NC.

last i heard they were thinking about making other trades do the same. go figure.

[This message has been edited by targetshootr (edited 08-13-2003).]

I am in the A/C business. It kinda sounds like you have been "flat rated".
The premise is that you are given a total price for the work + diagnostic charge. The customer is supposed to be happier because of knowing the total up front.

It is rare that the customer comes out better with flat-rate than straight T&M.
Typically it is a way to charge a big price for each individual thing and run the bill up.

Flat rate is being touted as the next great thing for service companies and some are making big bucks doing it.
It remains to be seen whether those companies will survive in the long run.


In fairness though, was this an after hours call?
You had the option of saying no.....and being hot. Or calling some one else.

You did get what you paid for. Cooling.
You just don't like what you paid for it.


[This message has been edited by wolfdog (edited 08-13-2003).]

I'll take a stab at motor cost again. The net ate my reply last night. First, a $3000 unit would likely be big enough to be used in my church's main auditorium air conditioner. I agree, they are pricey but for good reason. First, unless you are dealing with very large systems, you are not dealing with just a motor, you are looking at a complete compressor assembly. That unit is hermetically sealed so servicing it is impractical. It must be designed and built to make it's 15 year service life with exactly ZERO problems - you can do no more service than give the case a smack. No access. It also has to run completely in an environment of freon and oil, got to use the right metals here. Also has to be able to put out a couple of hundred pounds of pressure, that's a lot of compressing. If the truth be known, I am amazed at how cheap air conditioning compressors are for what you get.
As far as prices, with the internet, anybody can check out the cost of systems. 10 minutes with Google and I can have a dozen prices for, say, a 5 ton split system air conditioner.

[This message has been edited by Big Jim (edited 08-14-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Big Jim (edited 08-14-2003).]

I take a stab at motor cost again. The net ate my reply last night. First, a $3000 unit would like be big enough to be used in my church's main auditorium air conditioner. But, I agree, they are pricey but for good reason. First, unless you are dealing with very large systems, you are not dealing with just a motor, you are looking at a complete compressor assembly. That unit is hermetically sealed so servicing it is impractical. It must be designed and built to make it's 15 year service life with exactly ZERO problems - you can do no more than give the case a smack. No access. It also has to run completely in an environment of freon and oil, got to use the right metals here. Also has to be able to put out a couple of hundred pounds of pressure, that's a lot of compressing. If the truth be known, I am amazed at how cheap air conditioning compressors are for what you get.
As far as prices, with the internet, anybody can check out the cost of systems. 10 minutes with Google and I can have a dozen prices for, say, a 5 ton split system air conditioner.

Hey there Big Jim,

The $3,500 bid and the $3,000 bid were for two different 2nd story condos, about 1,000 square feet, in California, next to a residential street, easy access to the roof, the unit is set on the roof about 20 feet from the edge of the building.

It's interesting that almost all the A/C contractors around there (Glendale, Burbank CA area) seem to be Armenians or Syrians, and they seem to be organized somehow, connected, and holding the rates way up there.