ECN Forum Forums Code Related Discussion NEC & other Code issues Lighting outlets and luminaires.

Hmmm... I never even thought of those. Usually the only time I see those covers is during a service call or demo job in an older building.
I’m wondering though, since that is technically a flush cover mounted device… would the two screw requirement for devices in surface mount covers still apply?

Do they also make a flush device cover like that for round NM ceiling boxes?

I’m just imagining the look of perplexed disbelief on the inspectors face when he sees the TR duplex in the middle of the ceiling.

"perplexed disbelief on the inspectors"

Now you're tempting me, KJ ...

I believe the two screw requirement does apply. I've seen those covers in 4/0 size, which will mount on a round plastic box. It won'nt be pretty, but it does the job.

For an earlier poster, I don't think the NEC uses the term 'lampholder' any more, except for something that is directly mounted on the end of a cord (temporary lighting festoons). They're all 'luminaires,' even the keyless ones.

I think the lampholder verses luminaire issue may be more of a local building code issue than NEC.
As I recall, possibly something about lampholders being okay for inhabitable areas like attics, basements, garages and crawl spaces, but not so much for habitable areas.
This may possibly have been due to home buyers purchasing the "builder homes" during the housing boom, equipped with all the cheapest crap the local home centers had to offer, such as vanities and cabinets, etc... and having the venerable keyless installed everywhere a light fixture was required just to get the final electrical and CO signed off, then having them remain in place for years after the sale.

The funny thing is if I screw a "globe" lamp in an Edison socket it is a designer luminaire but if I screw in a regular A-19 it is sub standard lamp holder.

As far as 210.70 and article 100 is concerned they are all lighting outlets.

KJ- never had an issue. They just need a light fixture.
Too lazy to type luminaire,unless an official doc.
With the lack of above mentioned LIGHT, A switched rec has always been enough.So now why would you need a designer 'Fixture'?

I have had many sign offs with keyless, of course meeting requirements for closets and such.

I know your south, but are you south of either bridge?

I would definitely get a reference.That just aint right.
Snob rules perhaps. I bought in my town for the 1 acre rule (no lots under 1 acre are build able).
Now they want to change it (smaller). !!???!!! I gotta move again!!!!?

Greg, you nailed it! Spend $40 for the bulb and $100 for the (keyless) thats great.

The irony is, there have been several og my jobs where all that was present were 'keyless' fixtures - and it has never been an issue.

I often instal a keyless during construction, as a source of light for the painters, etc. Heck, sometimes I have them up before the rock is hung! Apart from the convenience of having a light, it is an easy way for me to 'proof test; my wiring - especially when there are multiple switches.

I seem to remember part of that discussion as being would a blank plate meet the intent. The reasoning was the "lighting outlet" had been installed which satified the code. The code did not specify that the luminaire be installed. Seems like splitting hairs and going contrary to the ever elusive "intent", but don't really see much difference than the switched receptacle installed without a lamp which would satify the requirement.

Maybe the design manual needs a rewrite to clarify? wink

Jim:
From the '08 NEC & Handbook:
410.22 Outlet Boxes to Be Covered.
In a completed installation, each outlet box shall be provided with a cover unless covered by means of a luminaire canopy, lampholder, receptacle, or similar device.

I have seen many resi jobs with blank covers on lighting outlets, WHEN there are multiple lighting outlets within a room/area. Reasoning varies from 'availability of fixture', to 'homeowner to supply', to 'ran out of $$$', etc. This ranges from normal modest SFD's, to McMansions & townhouses/condos.

For a CO, there must be an operational means of illumination, be it one keyless, one 'el-cheapo', or the proverbial half switched receptacle outlet. No, there does not have to be a lamp plugged in, just a switch control.

I agree, the NEC does not mandate a luminaire be installed in black & white words, and I also believe the 'intent' is to provide illumination for the safety of the occupants. The 'meat' of having a minimum of one operational luminaire is contained within our CO requirements.

Jim I always took the stand that an unqualified person had to be able to get a light on in that room for it to satisfy the intent of 210.70.
Any homeowner can plug in a lamp or screw in a bulb but it takes a bit more skill to actually hang and wire a luminaire.
I suppose in some places you might even need a permit if the strictest interpretation of the code was followed.

Others say the definition of lighting outlet just says "An outlet intended for the direct connection of a lampholder or luminaire." and the luminaire does not to be present.

I think we're confusing bodes, and forgetting just who is in charge.

It is the AHJ who approves the NEC, not the other way around.

Nor does the NEC say a think about the CofO. That is strictly an AHJ issue, and often requires that multiple AHJ's sign off on it. Exactly what "ready for occupanecy' is going to vary according to each AHJ involved.

As an example of AHJ discretion, I can see a single family, new home having the owner later supply the fixtures ... while such an expectation would be unreasonable for a rooming house or a restaurant.