ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area Tree toast

Didn't look like there was much in terms of flames after the power cut out... I'm assuming that was mostly steam and not smoke as you can hear it boiling through the bark at points in the video.

Had a 4" limb from a neighbor's tree fall on the primary a few years back... Not much in terms of flames, but the line did cut about halfway through the limb before the power was cut. The tree survived, although it was trimmed a little nicer after the incident.

I'd like to put my own opinion to this thread.

After having done 20 years as a Fire Officer, I would back electure up (not because he is a Moderator here or anything like that).

The simple fact of the matter is, the initial call to the emergency services was not made!

In any situation like that over here, a "heads-up" is all it takes to get some sort of a response started.

Yet these clowns stood there and continued to record video footage.

It is sites like this and YouTube that encourage people to get their camera or phone camera out and forget about reality, the reality of it is, someone should be notified that this is going on, even though Mr Great Camera Guy is getting the footage.

Just as a note, Break actually pays people to get stuff like this.

On the side of reality, we do respond to anything involving power lines arcing and trees meeting them, we can stand back, but at least we are there on the fire-ground, at a safe distance.

Let's be real about this whole scenario.

Would I marvel at the power? absolutely, it is so rare that we ever get to see what power is available. I have witnessed a HV line that touched the ground and smiled in excitement over the scene. I only made sure that the people did not stare at the light and kept well back but I don't recall who called the fire department except a police car was first on scene and he got closer than I would have which I told him. That was a case where a guy in a hardhat was influential enough to get a cop to move.
Would I call 911? yes if there is a phone available. I am guessing these "morons" had a phone close by.
I am delighted that someone recorded it and posted it. That video could become a very valuable resource and had they not just sat there and taped it we would not be debating their intelligence. I do agree there is a lack of civic minded-ness in society and we truly are in a me only world. That is another debate. I still think that labelling them morons for taping the incident is irrelevant but I agree them not calling the FD is indicative of a greater problem and for that I will accept they could have shown a little more UN-common sense.
A few years ago there was a video of a transformer fire beside a golf course. Most of the videos showed the last few minutes before the transformer exploded but at least 1 copy showed almost 15 minutes of people strolling past the substation on to their next hole. Any of those people would have been severely burned had their timing been worse. Those people were morons as they did not seem to even acknowledge the arcing as a hazard. these morons at least stayed far enough away.
I live in a garden city and I am more than aware of how hard it is to trim the trees to prevent these occurrences. I lived in a condo that had 3 cedars planted within 3 meters of the building and were growing above the roof and roots into the grade level suites and the water proof membrane in the electrical room and garage. I was on council and every year we would recommend the removal of these trees as they were causing so much damage at the ground and at the roof too. For 3 years the strata voted to pay the damages and keep the trees. I moved out of that building and it was 3 more years until they finally relented once the new roof had to be replaced again.

Mikesh, you've hit on something here ... as has 'electure' with his comments. This is: the failure to respond appropriately to an emergency situation.

To respond properly, first you have to recognize that there IS an emergency. Then you have to determine that it is your place to act. Then you have to take the right action.

I don't think the folks who watched this fire had the slightest clue as to what was hapening. Certainly none of them fully appriciated the gazillion or so watts of powere that were flowing .... or that power lines are not on circuit breakers like the ones in our homes. You can see one guy rather near the base of the tree; obviously he does not understand 'stray current.'

In the exerpt I posted (from the news story), it is also clear that the 911 operator did not have a full appreciation of the problem. All I can say is: don't be afraid to call again! Also, don't be afraid to argue or be blunt.

As an example, I had a customer call me to a building where the service mast was pulling off the building, had separated from the meter can, and the conductors were damaged. I had some difficulty getting the PoCo to respond; finally I told them bluntly that the next call would be from the Fire Department, when those feeders shorted out. I got my response, and repairs were made inside of 20 minutes of the troubleman's arrival. Don't be afraid to push when you have to.

Any tree subjected to large amperages like this becomes useless for carpentry, BTW. A direct lightning strike, for instance, will produce 'herringbone' shaped shakes and cracks right down and through the trunk, as I found out recently on two meadow oaks I bought. Burns ok in the stove though!

It might have no structural vaule, but those unusual patterns make for a very nice tabletop.

I have used some old 'lightning struck' seasoned chestnut boards, intended for coffins but superceded by cheaper-to-use veneered-board products. While you can get over some minor visible shakes by hiding them where they won't be seen, larger ones always seem to open up after a while on the finished work. These can be really dangerous part-quartered on a table edge, handrail or seat rail, as a 'spike' can peel out to injure the unsuspecting passing hand. Even rubbing glue in won't hold them. I think the huge stresses set up in the tree by the passage of massive currents, generating high pressure steam, must damage the wood on a micro level, and that stress eventually causes movement.

BTW, as an aside I once ripped up some lovely sycamore boards, to discover a couple riddled with dozens of 9mm lead bullets! Nothing more sinister than target practice I hope.

I'm sort of interested in what happened in this video. The intensity of the arc got worse as the video progressed. I wonder why? Presumably the tree dried as it let off steam, but maybe it carbonized and thus became more conductive?

Why the hugely intense flash at the end? Did the flames/smoke become severe enough to allow enough conduction? Flashover to those distribution lines?

What do ya'll think?

-John

I think you're seeing the result of the overloads kicking out - then re-energizing the line several times.

I don't know what everyone is going on about, as there is talk about calling someone ("the people") less than 20 seconds into the video... There are other comments in the video about some making a call, having made the call, etc.

I wouldn't be concerned about moving my car, however.