ECN Forum Forums Safety Discussion and News Occupational Safety Discussion The Blame Game

Greg ... though not specifically a "safety" example, you have stumbled upon a great example of the 'blame game.'

OK, so the NEC requires some disconnecting means, but is silent on the specifics. Somehow, everyone agreed that the little plug&socket connectors met the requirement. So far, so good.

Issue #1: Who installs them? Is it the electrician, the fixture maker, or the ballast maker? I notice that new fixtures come with them already installed, but that replacement ballasts do not. From this I deduce that it is the fixture maker who installs them.

Issue #2: For old work and maintenance, the things obviously need to be installed by the electrician. Since he's likely to be replacing the ballast at this point, it would make sense if the ballast came with the devices. They do not; it's up to tge sparky to obtain them.

Issue #3: Where do you get them? Well, the electrician goes to the parts house, where he is almost certain to find ones made by Ideal. Alas, I have never seem a luminaire manufacture waiting in line there; they must have other resources.

Issue #4: What should these devices look like? Despite the very existance of NEMA - it's no accident that bulb sizes are standardized - there's been no effort made to standardise the plug&socket. Therefore, it is wuite possible that every maker of these connectors will come up with a different arrangement, using different design criteria.

The result: Monies spent on these connectors by manufacturers are monies wasted. Since the replacement connectors will not matych the existing ones, we're back to working 'hot,' as we replace the connectors.

Oddly enough, the solution lies with not just the ballast makers, but with one in particular: Advance. With their large share of both the new fixture and ballast markets, whatever connector they choose will become the "norm." Yet, they are the one party involved that is under no obligation to instal the things.

Were Advance to settle on a design, I suspect that Ideal would find a way to supply this design to the parts houses - even if their current design is not the one selected.

The only reason that there is no 'industry standard' is that the NEMA members don't want there to be one. Everyone wants 'their' design to remain exclusively theirs ..... and the one guy with the market power to impose a decision is keeping out of the fray.

What we have here is the equivalent of every toaster maker either not supplying a plug, or supplying one that matches no known receptacle - and the solution laying in the cord-maker's hands.

well Reno,
many of us are under the assumption that the 'Hidden hand of the Market' is self correcting, self serving, providing us all with an amicable end result

but i find that concept to be somewhat foolishly predicated on the expected good will and good nature of mankind given a capitalist system that clear does not

here we really only have the stick, but not the carrot , and who really advocates an entity who's all about collusion and collaboration with jackbooted beauracracy other than the obligatory lip service?

the picture gets even more skewed when the onus of compliance is attached to the employer

the best anology there (and one that might be palatable to the cultural gap here) is health care falling on the employer's back

how exactly that happened is a long story (i'll refrain) but the stigmatism after a generation is exactly the same

does your employer pay for your house insurance? car insurance?

etc, ad nasuem....

so in said respect, why is it we are in a trade with hazards that the employer is responsible for educating us to?

perspective please....?

~S~

Sparky, I take it that you are -with your reference to the 'hidden hand'- taking exception to my suggesting a common plug design.

I can't say I object, and I am sure things will -eventually- shake out. Until then, the code requirement, and the anticipated increase in safety, is just so much more eyewash.

My point was also that, in this case, the 'hidden hand' has a name attached to it: Advance. That's how dominant they are.

Otherwise, the guy who replaces the ballast has zero input into the purchase of the fixture, let alone the manufacture of it. Sure, the parts house might attempt to offer many different makes of the connectors ... but this isn't likely to accomplish much; if nothing else, as every Chinese plant comes up with it's own design.

exception?....no, not at all Reno, in fact it's a grand example....



well here we have the onus of safety foisted upon what is sometimes refered to as supply side economics insinuating compliance by proxy

but what real motivation does any manufacturer have in providing it other than a $$$ in their back pocket?



yet said guy is held responsible to the extent of fines and loss of work

more $$$ made eh?

perhaps a better anology would have been our wod's? there's nothing quite like the specture of monetary interests to kick the crap out of any altruism....~S~

oh and, to add here, i have a small jar full of those ideal brand 'disconnects'

one more connection to fail for a callback imho

~S~