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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,445
Likes: 2
Cat Servant
Member
I think you need, first of all, to be careful with your terms. Words mean things ... sometimes very specific things ... and can have a direct bearing on the answers you get.

"Journey" men pre-date college degrees by several centuries. Then, as now, they were expected to follow the work, from job to job. Sure, today most limit their travels to the same community ... but the actual place they work changes daily.
The short answer is: to become a Journeyman, you MUST first be an apprentice. Not so long ago, this meant having a recognized master take you under his wing for several years of work and training.
Today, the "Journeyman" credential is issued either by a Union, or a government body (usually local). The "apprentice" programs are regulated under Federal DOL standards, and usually monitored by your state.

The effect of all this is that it is almost impossible to be allowed to even sit for the Journeyman test without first being accepted to a state-recognized apprenticeship program. Such programs typically require four years of specific course work (which may earn an Associates' degree), and at least the equivalent of 4 years of full time work, for a licensed electrical contractor, with the work documented to cover different parts of the trade. 4 calendar years of seasonal work roping houses won't suffice.

NOW- maybe you didn't really mean 'journeyman electrician.' Perhaps it is your intent to, say, work in a factory, keeping things running. This is honorable, and skilled, work. While sharing many things with the work performed by a journeyman, there is a much heavier emphasis on controls and motors. You'll never be dealing with services or 3-way switches.
For this work, there are a variety of trade schools and community colleges with 'industrial maintenance' programs. These typically result in an Associates' Degree.

Finally ... the "4 year degree" you mention. I am not aware of ANY such degree that will result in your being able to take a Journeyman test anywhere. Not even 'electrical engineering;' that's a different discipline altogether.

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 169
S
Member
I should have said that one of the people i worked for went out of buiness. As a former CNC Machinist there is no problem finding a job. I work only part time for a older guy who was nice enough to keep me on and try to get my hours in. I did take a year off when work was slow and went back to a shop writeing CNC programs. I enjoy the electrical field very much. It just took a little longer than I thought. Once you have the license you are free to make as much or little money as you want. Its all up to you. Just find a reputable contractor to work for and beware of shock and trip and falling hazards and you will be fine.Best thing i like about the electrical field is bucket truck work.

Last edited by steve ancient apprentice; 08/26/07 11:42 AM.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 138
P
Member
I believe anyone can take a Journeyman test with the SBCCI- at least they could when I took it. This doesn't mean you get a license. The test is recognized by many states (including NV). I took it before licensing was required here in TX, just to satisfy some a local inspector. It did not get me a license because none were required here at the time. I had served a four year apprenticeship program but I don't recall that coming up in the application.

When they started licensing journeymen here in TX a couple of years ago, they basically licensed everyone who could certify the required xx hours. Consequently, there are many JW who never served any type of apprenticeship or took any classes in electrical theory. The title JW is severely diluted as a result.

Nope, never worked maintenance by have worked in my share of factories. I see no difference in installing a 5,000 amp service, a 4,000 I/O PLC system, or terminating fiber optic cables. It all works on basic principles of physics. I have roped a couple of houses, and will leave the rest of them for the guys from El Salvador to do. By the way, they do have services in factories and they do have more three ways than any house.

Unions do not (or at least did not) recognize the 'master' title. It's been 25 years since I worked in that environment so I don't know if they do now or not.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 853
L
Member
"Nope, never worked maintenance by have worked in my share of factories. I see no difference in installing a 5,000 amp service, a 4,000 I/O PLC system, or terminating fiber optic cables. It all works on basic principles of physics. I have roped a couple of houses, and will leave the rest of them for the guys from El Salvador to do. By the way, they do have services in factories and they do have more three ways than any house."


Boy this makes me feel good.

Feel free to wire my EX's House.... Better still don't. I have a conscience.

"I have roped a couple of houses, and will leave the rest of them for the guys from El Salvador to do."

Why? Too much work for ya?

"When they started licensing journeymen here in TX a couple of years ago, they basically licensed everyone who could certify the required xx hours."

Like looking in a mirror?


WOW!!!! God Bless America!

I'm Disgusted now.

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,445
Likes: 2
Cat Servant
Member
Let's keep on topic.

The guy asked how to become a Journeyman Electrician. Not how to be an engineer, or laborer, or anything else. He then laid out some methods of training that would lead to competence in a related trade ... but not recognition as a journeyman electrician.

Words mean things. You say "journeyman," I want to see the card, the credential. The term itself means that some other tradesman has vouched for your having mastered ALL the basics of the trade.
It's no surprise that unions are closely associated with journeyman credentials; the very concept was invented in the Middle Ages by trade guilds. Recent decades have seen the establishment of non-union affiliated apprenticeship programs, but the concept is the same.

However, the term "electrician" covers a lot of ground .... and the range is getting greater every day. It's no surprise that there are countless related trades- folks who work with electricity, but do not concentrate on chasing after new jobs.
One such related trade is the "Industrial Maintenance Electrician.' Such a person typically gets his formal training, and certificate, from either a trade school or community college.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 7
T
New Member
Originally Posted by renosteinke
I think you need, first of all, to be careful with your terms. Words mean things ... sometimes very specific things ... and can have a direct bearing on the answers you get.

"Journey" men pre-date college degrees by several centuries. Then, as now, they were expected to follow the work, from job to job. Sure, today most limit their travels to the same community ... but the actual place they work changes daily.
The short answer is: to become a Journeyman, you MUST first be an apprentice. Not so long ago, this meant having a recognized master take you under his wing for several years of work and training.
Today, the "Journeyman" credential is issued either by a Union, or a government body (usually local). The "apprentice" programs are regulated under Federal DOL standards, and usually monitored by your state.

The effect of all this is that it is almost impossible to be allowed to even sit for the Journeyman test without first being accepted to a state-recognized apprenticeship program. Such programs typically require four years of specific course work (which may earn an Associates' degree), and at least the equivalent of 4 years of full time work, for a licensed electrical contractor, with the work documented to cover different parts of the trade. 4 calendar years of seasonal work roping houses won't suffice.

NOW- maybe you didn't really mean 'journeyman electrician.' Perhaps it is your intent to, say, work in a factory, keeping things running. This is honorable, and skilled, work. While sharing many things with the work performed by a journeyman, there is a much heavier emphasis on controls and motors. You'll never be dealing with services or 3-way switches.
For this work, there are a variety of trade schools and community colleges with 'industrial maintenance' programs. These typically result in an Associates' Degree.

Finally ... the "4 year degree" you mention. I am not aware of ANY such degree that will result in your being able to take a Journeyman test anywhere. Not even 'electrical engineering;' that's a different discipline altogether.


In Virginia to take the Journeyman Electrician test:

http://www.contractors-license.org/va/Virginia.html

- four years of practical trade experience and 240 hours of vocational training.

- an associate degree from a Department-approved program and two years of practical experience

- an bachelor's degree from a Department-approved program and one year of practical experience

- ten years of documented Department-approved practical experience

For Virginia, Electrical Engineering is an approved program. But i cant find what other degrees count. frown

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,445
Likes: 2
Cat Servant
Member
Thank you, Tom, for the correction. Virginia certainly is in the minority - but please note that there is still a work requirement. Don't be surprised if the work is required to be in Virginia, for a Virginia-licensed electrical contractor.

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 10
F
Junior Member
I worked for the Federal Government. I got them to pay for my apprenticeship classes that I took in the evenings at Fairfax County Adult continuing education. Prior to graduating, I took the journeyman test and passed, and prior to taking the exam, I retired from the government. Now I am an electrical contractor in north Carolina. I had to take the exam here. I will be taking a more advanced test so I can do commercial work also. I am in school here two nights a week for the contractors test. The class only cost me 65.00 and runs from July to December. I still hold my Virginia journeyman license, and when I pass the limited exam here I can get a Va masters license automatically because the states are reciprocal.
You need verified work experience and school hours in both states.

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,213
S
Member
What constitutes "one year practical experience"? How many hours a week is enough? Does it have to be under a master electrician, or can it simply be practical electrical work? I'm in VA, btw.

I'm an engineer and, well, don't work for a master electrician. Thus, most of my "practical experience" was in building my home. And let me tell you- it sucks to see obvious easy problems I wouldn't hesitate to fix in my own home, yet be completely unable to legally touch them. Do design, oversight & inspection of electrical work count as practical experience?

Last edited by SteveFehr; 09/06/07 10:42 PM.
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,923
Likes: 32
G
Member
Steve, why wouldn't you be able to work on things in your home? Va does have owner/builder permits doesn't it?
Maryland issued me a building permit along with grading, roof, plumbing, HVAC and electrical for a 1000 sq/ft, 2 story addition I put on.
Florida let me build a pool, screen cage and pool electric.


Greg Fretwell
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