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#135911 02/23/03 06:29 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 26
K
Member
Is this photo from Sweden? Looks like an EKLK 5G1.5 cable. The second ground wire (the shield or bi-ledare) should be marked with green/yellow electrical tape and only connected to earth at one point of the installation, in the fuse panel for example. Try to figure out what kind of device the cable was attached to.
It’s pretty hard to guess.


Fuseman
#135912 02/23/03 02:13 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,498
Likes: 1
C
C-H Offline OP
Member
Kent:

>Is this photo from Sweden? Looks like an EKLK 5G1.5 cable.

Right on.

>[The shield ground]... only connected to earth at one point of the
>installation, in the fuse panel for example.

May I disagree?

{Warning: Swedish!}

Enligt Elsäkerhetsverkets hemsida:

Biledaren i en kabel är avsedd och dimensionerad enbart för skyddsjordning av metallmanteln i sådana kablar där metallmanteln är en utsatt del (413.1.1.2). Biledaren får därför inte användas för skyddsjordning av andra utsatta delar som till exempel kopplingsdosor av metall eller anslutna apparater och bruksföremål.

Biledaren skall vara förbunden med skyddsledaren på ett sätt som säkerställer att manteln är effektivt skyddsjordad och att utlösningsvillkoret är uppfyllt vid en spänningssättning av manteln (413.1.1.1). Dessa villkor kan vid kortare gruppledningar normalt uppfyllas genom att biledarna ansluts till skyddsledarskenan i en central och sedan sammankopplas i de olika kopplingspunkterna.

För att skyddsjordningen av manteln alltid skall vara säkerställd bör biledaren företrädesvis vara ansluten till skyddsledaren i kretsens båda ändar det vill säga även i anslutna bruksföremål och liknande.

Om det är nödvändigt för att till exempel motverka risk för störningar kan dock biledarkretsen anslutas till skyddsledare i endast en punkt. Anslutningen bör då göras i kretsens matande ände.

[This message has been edited by C-H (edited 02-23-2003).]

#135913 02/23/03 03:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 26
K
Member
Visst, biledaren är ju bara till för att ”jorda” metallmanteln och som ”störningsavledare” inget annat. Det är ju inte som i de gamla blykablarna där skyddsjorden utgjordes av en biledare. Fick lära mig på en kurs att det räcker med anslutning i en ände. Men sedan har andra sagt att den ska anslutas i båda. Jag vet inte vad som är rätt. Brukar lägga in den i matande ände och klippa den i andra. Sedan upprepar man bara i vare kopplingspunkt. Lägg ihop med jord, klipp.


Fuseman
#135914 02/24/03 11:50 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,498
Likes: 1
C
C-H Offline OP
Member
Nåja, ur säkerhetssynpunkt spelar det ingen roll hur man gör så länge man inte har väldigt långa kablar och impedansen blir för stor för att ett jordfel skall kunna ta ut säkringen snabbt. Själv tycker jag att det mest verkar onödigt med två jordledare. Vad var det för fel med bara skärmjord? Det funkar ju på EKKJ. [Linked Image]

#135915 02/24/03 10:32 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 382
H
Member
Time to drag out my 23 year old Icelandic ...

Talatu Ensku?

Tak Fyrir!

Hutch

Well, it was a long time ago [Linked Image]

#135916 03/22/03 01:48 AM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,443
Likes: 3
Member
Let's sort of have replies in English, if we can!.
How Rude!. [Linked Image]

#135917 03/22/03 08:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,253
D
djk Offline
Member
That's exactly why there should be an EU standard plug-in light fitting.

Every light fitting should come with this plug (perhaps along the lines of the British "Click" system) so if DIYer wants to install a fancy light fitting all they have to do is unclip the basic one and insert the new one. I've never understood the requirement for hardwired light fittings!

It was and still is quite common here to use BS546 (5amp?) sockets behind suspended ceilings for lighting and for shop display cabinates etc. to make life easier.

I've even seen 1930's lights here in Ireland that were connected to a ceiling rose which had 3 hooks on the sides to support the heavy glass shade with decorative chains avoiding putting strain on the cable (usually a twisted pair). They seemed like a much more flexible and ornate way of doing things.

#135918 03/23/03 09:17 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
P
Member
Well, English is the primary language of ECN, but I don't think it would hurt to allow an odd message or two in other languages in the international section.

Our Continental friends do an excellent job of comprehending and writing English in what is a technical field. Sometimes it can be hard to find the the right words to express something in a foreign language: I've stood there scratching my head in France trying to work out how to express something that it only too easy in English. [Linked Image]

#135919 03/24/03 02:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,691
S
Member
DJK,

No insult intended, but I fail to see how a "universal plug" design will prevent something like C-H has posted. [Linked Image]

The problem as I see it, is that someone ripped-off a surface mount device...leaving the exposed ends of the wires just hanging around. If anything, this is a good argument for outlawing surface-mount wiring methods like this, where the device is fastened directly to the wall instead of a box.

By the way, if there is to be a "universal plug standard," I believe there should be two, so it's easier to distinguish 110 volt sockets from 220 volt sockets. [Linked Image]

#135920 03/24/03 11:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,253
D
djk Offline
Member
I was refering to the problem of people ripping off expensive light fitting when they leave a house/apartment and leaving dangling cables.. would be much more sensible if these things were just plugged in / out.

Its quite common to walk into a house having bought it to find the side lights and ceiling lights removed. One couple even removed all of the pricy brass fittings and just left the house with wires sticking out of the wall where there should have been socket outlets having. they simply tripped the circuit breakers.

If it can be removed and it's worth removing people will remove it..

The scariest one is where you find a 35 amp cooker cable dangling in the kitchen where the cooker should be complete with nicely pared cables and no electrical tape. all someone has to do is flick the cooker switch to ON..

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