ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
Safety at heights?
by gfretwell - 04/23/24 03:03 PM
Old low volt E10 sockets - supplier or alternative
by gfretwell - 04/21/24 11:20 AM
Do we need grounding?
by gfretwell - 04/06/24 08:32 PM
UL 508A SPACING
by tortuga - 03/30/24 07:39 PM
Increasing demand factors in residential
by tortuga - 03/28/24 05:57 PM
New in the Gallery:
This is a new one
This is a new one
by timmp, September 24
Few pics I found
Few pics I found
by timmp, August 15
Who's Online Now
1 members (Scott35), 421 guests, and 34 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,682
Likes: 3
Admin Offline OP
Administrator
Member
Quote
I received a call to come out and give this guy a price to finish the electrical work, yeah right!

-HCE727
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by Webmaster (edited 12-12-2006).]

Stay up to Code with the Latest NEC:


>> 2023 NEC & Related Reference & Exam Prep
2023 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides

Pass Your Exam the FIRST TIME with the Latest NEC & Exam Prep

>> 2020 NEC & Related Reference & Study Guides
 

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,682
Likes: 3
Admin Offline OP
Administrator
Member
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 209
H
Member
Well, at least he doesn't have to derate his wire for bundling...

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 558
R
Member
At least they used wire nuts on all those flying splices [Linked Image] (** runs and ducks as screwdrivers and other pointy objects get thrown in my general direction***).
Ya I will say that has got to be the worst I have seen in a long time.. What a shame too all that expen$ive NM tied in a bow and connected to the panel. Guess the panel cover is going to act as one big cable clamp when its put on [Linked Image]

I noticed from the 6'th and last pic, where those tandem 20A breakers are,
Looks like to me BOTH red and black conductors of each 3-wire cable go to the same tandem breaker? I can see a neutral conductor getting a tad hot!
A.D

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 214
E
Member
ignoring all the very worse stuff, at least he used tandem breakers, 'cause you know, he doesn't have enough open space already [Linked Image] man there's just too much crud here to even comment on...
-Will

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2
M
Junior Member
I don't like tandem breakers. That whole thing is quite horrid. My church's main building (newest one-circa 1975) has a square D panel, and almost half of it is done this way (tandems).

You guys may want to see some pics of this place though...it might amuse you what you can find in a 1975 office/meeting complex. In addition to the tandems, it has major grounding issues (as the surge suppressors always seem to be burnt up...literally). And don't get me started on the other issues (such as backstabbed wiring and copier on a lighting circuit)...and this is only the one building. ;-)

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 52
K
KJ Offline
Junior Member
THINK THIS PROJECT WAS 'FINISHED' BEFORE YOU WERE CALLED......

QUESTION, THIS WAS AN UPGRADE...CORRECT.

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 272
L
Member
[Linked Image]

If there was a 'top ten' list... this gem should be on it!


Luke Clarke
Electrical Planner for TVA.

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 840
C
Member
Wiring's easy. Anybody can do it. [Linked Image] At least the demo will be easy. No staples to pull out.

[This message has been edited by CTwireman (edited 12-13-2006).]


Peter
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 152
A
Member
This is a great series of photos! Quote him some astronomical price and see if he takes the bait - you should be able to get this all fixed up lickkety-split the wires are all ID'ed.

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
E
Member
I think that whoever installed that service deserves a good flogging as well.


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 100
J
JJM Offline
Member
Any quote you decide to give absolutely must include demo costs; everything needs to be ripped out and start over.

I like how the panel board isn't really mounted directly onto the wall, with the board appearing to be mounted over that pipe... I hope it's not a gas line. The wood isn't even cut right for the size of the panel.

Actually, the panel mess isn't all that terrible if its only temp; I've seen a lot worse temp service, and it could always be cleaned up. It's the stuff that will eventually be covered up by the wall is what REALLY bothers me.

Bid high... if for nothing else than the education lesson for the HO.

Joe

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 273
C
Member
one word "YIKES!"

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 187
Member
I actually told the homeowner that this was the worst display of electrical work that I have ever saw. I also told him that I would not even touch it, that I would rip it all out and start over. This was a an old 3 story dog in which the 2nd and 3rd floor were already roughed in, that was a mess too!

[This message has been edited by HCE727 (edited 12-13-2006).]


Hank
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 169
S
Member
As i am so fond of saying,
YUCK, WHAT A MESS Rip it out and start over.

Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 943
Likes: 2
N
Member
What was the homeowners reply to condemming that mess?

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 821
S
Member
I like the flying splice in pic #4. [Linked Image]

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 200
H
Member
.....You've GOTTA be kidding me.


What the heck was this guy thinking?! Is that the POCO meter in pics 5 and 6? Did they see this crap mess when that meter was installed?!


Cliff
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 812
Member
Don't tell me Peco put a meter in with that mess there!

Ian A.


Is there anyone on board who knows how to fly a plane?
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,438
Member
I have a feeling the meter was there from the previous service, it looks a bit dated... (I don't think Westinghouse is doing meters anymore.. someone correct me if I'm wrong)

Instead of that goofy SE-R cable loop thing, a chase nipple between the meter and panel would've been a nice start.., but the flat wall space where everything is piled onto doesnt appear sufficient, move the panel 2 feet to the adjoining wall (which looks like it's turning to lime. Is this near the ocean?)
I'd likely discuss having a plumber move the 2 pipes to overhead.. A little cutting and threading on their end could save some headaches on yours [Linked Image]

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 391
B
Member
Is it me broken eyes or is that really #10 going to those two 50A double-poles in the bottom of that panel?

This is so bad it's almost a moral question: Do you bid low and repair it just to save the guy from himself??

That's painful to look at.

-John

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 745
E
Member
We still have Westinghouse meters around here being installed. I think that they are probably refurbished though. I think that service looks brand-new myself. My guess would be that the house was a dump and needed a full gutting.

Maybe they hired an EC to install a new service and probably had one circuit (properly) installed to a GFI receptacle. Note the new-looking MC cable leaving the upper left corner of the panel.

It's still a pretty sloppy looking service with the SEU cable being done like that.

I agree that it doesn't appear that there's anything larger than #8 in the panel, but my eyesight and monitor are so bad that I can't say for sure what the breaker ratings are. I did ask myself the same question though.

Since when are devices installed during rough wiring? What about two-gang boxes for single devices? Oh, I get it.........One gang required per cable!

How about a home run of 12/2 marked for "hallway light"? A single 20 amp circuit for a hallway light? No wonder they have such a big panel already being loaded up with skinnies!

Sad, sad, sad. No doubt that it's really a total gut job for sure now.

[This message has been edited by EV607797 (edited 12-14-2006).]


---Ed---

"But the guy at Home Depot said it would work."
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 361
C
Member
But it looked so easy in the book....
[Linked Image from homedepot.com]


~~ CELTIC ~~
...-= NJ =-...
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,438
Member
EV, I agree on the panel and the meter can being new, but that white pullcan that the meter is feeding from appears older than dirt... Over here in CA when we do a service upgrade, we just plug the old meter back into the panel.... Most of em here are CL200 unless you're getting into really old stuff....

I also dont see any type of seal on the meter can....

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 7
A
Junior Member
As far as I can tell the 8/3 is being fed from a 60A breaker and the 10/3 is being fed from a 50A breaker. I would like to see the inside of the meter can as I believe that it is probably reverse wired.
Allen

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 288
Y
Member
Westinghouse sold their meter division to ABB in 1990. The later models are definitely still being refurbished and re-used.

Yes, I would agree that the service is probably pre-existing. Are there any utilities left in North America that will allow a new residential service in a basement?

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
P
Member
Why was the flying splice in pic #3 there anyway? Maybe the guy was planning on another light there (like the one with the open splice to the right), or maybe his roll of Romex just ran out at that point so he wirenutted on another and carried on!

As for that panel...... [Linked Image] [Linked Image]

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 32
J
Member
Now we know were are scrap wire ends up when we scrap it.

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5